Welcome to good game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports. Every day, I'm bringing you the stakes, stars, stats, and stories to keep you up to date. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect the teamwork, competition, and rivalries that we love to watch. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen a good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Ever get the feeling someone's watching you?

We know they're looking for us.

Well, in 1971, a group of anti war activists had that feeling.

I was in the heart of the dragon, and it was my job to stop the fire.

So they decided to do something insane, break in to the FBI and expose J. Edgar Hoover's dirty secrets.

We had some idea that this was pretty explosive.

I'm Ed Helms. Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

In the early morning hours of September 6, 2016, St. Louis rapper and activist Darren Seals was found murdered.

That's what they gonna learn. On for death, on for nothing.

Every day Darren would tell her, all right, mom, be prepared. They are going to try to kill me.

All episodes available now listen to after the uprising, the murder of Darren Sealer on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

My name is Curly.

And I'm Maya.

And welcome to the Super Secret Bestie Club podcast.

A super secret club where we talk about super secret things.

Yeah, like secrets that are super.

That's what it is.

In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heartbreaks, men, and of course, our favorite secrets.

Get in here.

Listen to the super Secret bestie Club on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In 2009, Maitrice Richardson was released from the Malibu Lost Hill Sheriff station, and she never made it home. Nearly a year later, Maitrice's remains were found in a canyon 6 miles from the station. Her death is Malibu's greatest unsolved mystery. I'm Dana Goodyear in Lost Hills Dark Canyon. What happened to Maitrice Richardson? Listen on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. On this episode of Betrayal, you're going to meet a survivor of male sexual assault. It's a Hollywood actor. Many of us have an affinity for Anthony Edwards. If you watched ER in the 1990s or early two thousands, then you might have known him as Doctor Mark Green. Green and before that as goose in the iconic film Top my thirties. I think the way in which the abuse that I suffered affected my relationships primarily was sort of a deep lack of trust. I was abused by somebody who was living in our house. He was a boarder in order to help cover the rent. We were pretty poor and my mother was a refugee from Europe and this guy was a. A refugee from Asia, from all World War two. And he would come into my brother and I my bedroom and he would wake me up by suffocating me and then he would take me out of the room. And between our bedroom and his room, there was a hallway about maybe 8ft. And in that 8ft of every night, I would be terrified, knowing what is about to happen to me again. And my brother is sleeping over there, 10ft from me. My mother is 10ft down the hall this way. And I'm alone and nobody's protecting me. I was five years old and that's where I lost my trust. If my mother doesn't protect me, if my brother doesn't protect. I had no father.There's nobody. I don't have trust in anybody. And it took me a good chunk of my life to get out of that hallway. Yeah, to get out of that hallway. Exactly, yeah. Yeah.That moment affected everyone in the room. It was heartbreaking. Not only the awful abuse David suffered, but the years it took for him to process and work through the trauma. Anthony pointed out that Tyler was changing the pattern.You're setting an example, not of success, that it's all gone and done and we got rid of it. But the shame is less. You're not going to carry that. You're not going to carry what's not yours. You know, this was done to you, not because of you.Coming up, doctor David Liszak explains how Tyler's experience was like living in a war zone.Welcome to good game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports. Every day, I'm bringing you the stakes, stats, stars and stories to keep you up to date. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. Can't wait to show you around. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. We want good game to be just like women's sports. The best of the competition, teamwork and rivalries that we love, minus the toxic masculinity in drunken brawls. Where else but women's sports? Do we see a player passing her ex wife on the WNBA's all time leading scorer list and then watch her new fiance, teammate, and MVP candidate talk about it afterward on SportsCenter. Shout out to Duana Bonner and Alyssa Thomas. The tea, y'all. The tea is so good. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect those stories and all aspects of women's sports. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen to good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.Late on the evening of March 8, 1971, a group of anti war activists did something insane.Holy sh t. We are really here. This is really happening.They weren't professional criminals. They were ordinary citizens. But they needed to know the truth about the FBI.Burglaries, forged blackmail letters, and threats of violence were used to try to stop.Anti war marches, even if that meant risking everything.I just felt like I was living in the heart of the dragon, and it was just my job to stop the fire.I'm Ed Helms, host of Snafu season two, Medburg, the story of a daring heist that exposed J. Edgar Hoover's secret FBI.If it meant some risks that were.Involved, well, that's what citizens sometimes have to do.Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.It all started with two federal agents who heard a rumor she mentions. Well, there is this alleged murder to have taken place. There was just one problem. They had no clue who the victim was. We have to do our job, and we have to find out. Who did they kill? It had been 15 years since this alleged murder. Was it still possible to unearth the truth?I used to watch the unsolved mystery shows, and I often thought about calling because I was like, this is. This is not right. How can a person get killed and no one knows anything?I'm Jake Halpern, and this is deep cover, the nameless man. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.We are sitting with Stacey and Tyler as they speak with actor Anthony Edwards and clinical psychologist doctor David Liesack. Here's Anthony.To this day, I believe the perpetrator, in my experience, believed that he was doing it because that's what I needed, what I wanted, because there was a lack of. Of that role model in my life. I didn't have a father figure he was going to be the father figure. That exploitation of someone's desire is where they get in. Oh, you want to be loved. Oh, your dad's not around. Oh, you want this, you want to be part of a group, you want to have a career, you want to succeed. And you learn that love is conditional. There's no such thing as unconditional love if you're not experiencing it. That is love. Love is conditional.Yeah.So you don't trust. You don't trust. I say that's why I became a good actor, because I could go into a room and I could assess everything. Because you need to know where you're safe, where you're not, who you can trust. So you get really good at playing a room to know how to survive. Surviving is the most important thing, because when your spirit's broken like that, you feel like you'll die if you don't.Yeah. No. It's hard to find joy in things, really. Like, I would say I've worked past my depression and I've worked on myself. I've come very far, but it's hard to really find something I enjoy. Like, I love watching a movie with my mom or my girlfriend, but, like, I couldn't do that alone. I wouldn't enjoy it. I don't know what I want to do. I know I want to do something big and important, make a change, but I have no clue really what that is.It's interesting that you both felt this need to overachieve in your own ways. Where do you think that comes from?In my head, I, like picture where I want my life to be. And like, I just sometimes tell myself, I know I'll be happy when I have that dream job and I have that wife that loves me and that family that I wanted in that house that's paid off and that maybe not sports car, but decent car. I'm not looking for anything crazy, but still, that's what I want.But the irony, of course, is that you're using all of these conditions to do it. I use techniques that I learned which were conditional. Oh, if I do this, if I get this role, then that will take care of it. If I get this, that will be. If I find the right person, then I will have the perfect family. It was always looking ahead as opposed to right here and now. So I have to do all these things to get there. And that is a habit trail or a spinning wheel that is impossible to maintain your whole life. But as long as I was in the mindset of this and this, and this is going to make me happy. It didn't work. It didn't work. Happiness is very hard to achieve when you're conditioned to have to do something to get love.Yeah, I live a lot in, like, what he was saying. You constantly tell yourself, oh, I'll be happy when I get this, or as I'm approaching this, I'll be happy. And yeah, I'll frequently say that, but I've been trying to be better about it.Anthony, as a child, to learn that love is conditional, that's a really scary thing. Was it, until you became a parent, did you unlock this unconditional love?It was directly related to being a parent. That's the miracle. Like, I found the strength to confront this man. When you're a parent and you experience that unconditional love, it changes you with.The stigma and the fact that men typically don't disclose until much later in life. Could the number be.Actually, we know it is different. That's just what's. I mean, David could speak to that.It's a notoriously difficult area to study because there's actually a couple studies that have shown that even when you have documentary evidence that a man was sexually abused as a child, and you then ask them later in life if they were ever sexually abused, the vast majority of those men will deny it. Some have lost the memory. Most probably are just not willing to respond. So, as a researcher, I conducted many studies and found, you know, about one in six men were acknowledging that they had had some kind of experience that meets the definition of sexual abuse. And I'm absolutely certain that it is only, you know, some fraction of the actual number. What the actual number is, I can't even guess. It's greater than one in six, that's for sure.The conversation about denial sparked a thought from Tyler's mom, Stacy.You even said, had it not been for the discovery of the cameras in our home, he intended to take it to his grave. I mean, that was just his. His thought.I mean, the plan was to get the hell out. I kept telling myself, next year it'll stop because I'll be older, I'll look more like a man. And it never stopped. And I just kept telling myself, I can push through high school.You know, it's important to understand that the intensity of Tyler's need for purpose, it's the same as soldiers coming back from war. The experience in a war zone is so intense, you're frightened all the time. You see death, and it actually affects your brain. You know, your brain gets kind of reset to live on edge. And every second, every moment is charged with, you know, what if, what if, what if? And what do I have to do to survive this? When you live with the kind of daily fear that you lived with, you were in a combat zone.Yeah.You know, it's the same thing. And it really recalibrates your brain, and it takes, really a long time to sort of recalibrate again so that, yes, you could be in a situation where you are once again in that kind of a danger, but most of life isn't that way. It just takes a while to get to a point where your nervous system and your brain are kind of just a little bit more quiet. It's okay to just have a quiet day. You really were in combat, and you're coming out of it now.Stacey was sharing something with me this morning about one of her concerns for you. Do you want to share a little bit?A huge concern for me is when I start to feel that something's not okay with you, you're kind of quieter or things like that, and you tell me that you're okay. You're trained for so long to be quiet and to lie to everyone around you about what's going on in your world and how you feel. But I worry that there are times where he's telling me he's okay, and I'm still dealing with that child again, who's lying to me.You're bringing up just a really important part of all this, too. Everybody's affected by this event, these traumatic events. Everybody who loves and cares about these individuals is affected. And in the same way that you have to give Tyler space for his change, he also has to. And you have to take the space for yourself as a parent to process what it is to feel that, oh, my God, why didn't I do anything? How come I didn't protect. And so you have to allow yourself, your healing in this process, because you can't only be good if Tyler's good. You have to be good unto yourself. But you can't make your happiness conditional on whether or not Tyler recovers. Yeah, because he's going to. And he is recovering.It's worthwhile to remember from time to time that there's another part of the equation here, and that is that both of you were groomed. I've spent a lot of my career studying predators, and grooming is an integral part of these predations. And it's not just the direct victim who's groomed. We're in Boston here now, and I was here during the 1990 Catholic clergy eruption of cases. I interviewed a number of both victims of John Gagan, one of the most prolific predators and also the mothers of some of his victims. And Gagan was just a brilliant groomer, and he started by grooming mothers, which gave him access to the children. And he would then pick which one of the children, mostly boys, because he understood that boys are less likely to disclose. So you were both victimized by that grooming process, and that's something that you are still coping with. Yeah, everybody can be groomed. Everybody. What grooming is, is taking human trust and perverting it. It's almost impossible to detect it. And predators practice this, so they're not just doing this for the first time. They practice this over many, many years, and they get better and better and better at it.So everybody is susceptible to it.You typically hear from men that are much older than Tyler, can you talk about the impact of a conversation that's starting with a 19 year old on this public of a platform? What does that do to the overall conversation?Well, Tyler, let me turn a question to you.All right.Let's imagine that there's a 15 year old boy who's in a situation like you were in. What would you say to him?Probably tell him to listen to the podcast.Good start.I don't know. I'd probably tell them. It might seem like the end of the world, but it's not. I'm not gonna lie to you and tell you it's gonna be easy, but just like anything, you find ways to overcome it and it'll happen. It's possible. You just gotta want it.And one in six.org has tools to help.You can find not only therapists, you can find support groups, you can find peer support groups, you can find other survivors. What we are really focused on here is to confront and challenge the stigma that silences men, so that young men like Tyler here, who has the guts to come forward, we appreciate what you're doing, and we don't want you to be alone.Like what he was saying, men definitely minimize because I was talking to one of my buddies a while back, and he was talking about how he had lost his virginity at like twelve. And all betrayal content, news and updates. We're grateful for your support. One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review betrayal. Five star reviews go a long way. A big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of glass entertainment group in partnership with iHeart podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Faison. Hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Kerry Hartman. Also produced by Ben Fetterman and Trey Morgan. Associate producers are Kristin Melcury and Caitlin golden. Our iHeart team is Allie Perry and Jessica Kreinchuk. Special thanks to Stacey Rutherford, Tyler, and the rest of Stacey and Tyler's friends and family, and to Anthony Edwards, doctor David Lisak, and the entire one in six organization.Audio editing and mixing by Matt Vecchio editing support from Nico Aruca Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines Music Library provided by MIB Music and for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeart Radio Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports every day. I'm bringing you the stakes, stars, stats, and stories to keep you updated. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect the teamwork, competition, and rivalries that we love to watch. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen to good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.Ever get the feeling someone's watching you? Well, in 1971, a group of anti war activists had that feeling.I was in the heart of the dragon and it was my job to stop the fire.So they decided to do something insane, break in to the FBI and expose J. Edgar Hoover's dirty secrets.We had some idea that this was pretty explosive.I'm Ed Helms. Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.In the early morning hours of September 6, 2016, St. Louis rapper and activist Darren Seals was found murdered.That's what they gonna learn. On for death, on for nothing.Every day Darren would tell her, all right, mom, be prepared. They are going to try to kill me.All episodes available now listen to after the uprising, the murder of Darren Seals on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.How do you solve a crime in reverse when you believe that someone was murdered but have no clue who the victim was? We have to do our job, and we have to find out who did they kill? If it's possible, how are we gonna do that? I'm Jake Halpern, and this is deep the nameless man. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.My name is Curly.And I'm Maya.And welcome to the Super Secret Bestie Club podcast.A super secret club where we talk about super secret things.Yeah, like secrets that are super.That's what it is.In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heartbreaks, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets.Get in here.Listen to the super Secret bestie Club on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

my thirties. I think the way in which the abuse that I suffered affected my relationships primarily was sort of a deep lack of trust. I was abused by somebody who was living in our house. He was a boarder in order to help cover the rent. We were pretty poor and my mother was a refugee from Europe and this guy was a. A refugee from Asia, from all World War two. And he would come into my brother and I my bedroom and he would wake me up by suffocating me and then he would take me out of the room. And between our bedroom and his room, there was a hallway about maybe 8ft. And in that 8ft of every night, I would be terrified, knowing what is about to happen to me again. And my brother is sleeping over there, 10ft from me. My mother is 10ft down the hall this way. And I'm alone and nobody's protecting me. I was five years old and that's where I lost my trust. If my mother doesn't protect me, if my brother doesn't protect. I had no father.

There's nobody. I don't have trust in anybody. And it took me a good chunk of my life to get out of that hallway. Yeah, to get out of that hallway. Exactly, yeah. Yeah.

That moment affected everyone in the room. It was heartbreaking. Not only the awful abuse David suffered, but the years it took for him to process and work through the trauma. Anthony pointed out that Tyler was changing the pattern.

You're setting an example, not of success, that it's all gone and done and we got rid of it. But the shame is less. You're not going to carry that. You're not going to carry what's not yours. You know, this was done to you, not because of you.

Coming up, doctor David Liszak explains how Tyler's experience was like living in a war zone.

Welcome to good game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports. Every day, I'm bringing you the stakes, stats, stars and stories to keep you up to date. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. Can't wait to show you around. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. We want good game to be just like women's sports. The best of the competition, teamwork and rivalries that we love, minus the toxic masculinity in drunken brawls. Where else but women's sports? Do we see a player passing her ex wife on the WNBA's all time leading scorer list and then watch her new fiance, teammate, and MVP candidate talk about it afterward on SportsCenter. Shout out to Duana Bonner and Alyssa Thomas. The tea, y'all. The tea is so good. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect those stories and all aspects of women's sports. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen to good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Late on the evening of March 8, 1971, a group of anti war activists did something insane.

Holy sh t. We are really here. This is really happening.

They weren't professional criminals. They were ordinary citizens. But they needed to know the truth about the FBI.

Burglaries, forged blackmail letters, and threats of violence were used to try to stop.

Anti war marches, even if that meant risking everything.

I just felt like I was living in the heart of the dragon, and it was just my job to stop the fire.

I'm Ed Helms, host of Snafu season two, Medburg, the story of a daring heist that exposed J. Edgar Hoover's secret FBI.

If it meant some risks that were.

Involved, well, that's what citizens sometimes have to do.

Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

It all started with two federal agents who heard a rumor she mentions. Well, there is this alleged murder to have taken place. There was just one problem. They had no clue who the victim was. We have to do our job, and we have to find out. Who did they kill? It had been 15 years since this alleged murder. Was it still possible to unearth the truth?

I used to watch the unsolved mystery shows, and I often thought about calling because I was like, this is. This is not right. How can a person get killed and no one knows anything?

I'm Jake Halpern, and this is deep cover, the nameless man. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

We are sitting with Stacey and Tyler as they speak with actor Anthony Edwards and clinical psychologist doctor David Liesack. Here's Anthony.

To this day, I believe the perpetrator, in my experience, believed that he was doing it because that's what I needed, what I wanted, because there was a lack of. Of that role model in my life. I didn't have a father figure he was going to be the father figure. That exploitation of someone's desire is where they get in. Oh, you want to be loved. Oh, your dad's not around. Oh, you want this, you want to be part of a group, you want to have a career, you want to succeed. And you learn that love is conditional. There's no such thing as unconditional love if you're not experiencing it. That is love. Love is conditional.

Yeah.

So you don't trust. You don't trust. I say that's why I became a good actor, because I could go into a room and I could assess everything. Because you need to know where you're safe, where you're not, who you can trust. So you get really good at playing a room to know how to survive. Surviving is the most important thing, because when your spirit's broken like that, you feel like you'll die if you don't.

Yeah. No. It's hard to find joy in things, really. Like, I would say I've worked past my depression and I've worked on myself. I've come very far, but it's hard to really find something I enjoy. Like, I love watching a movie with my mom or my girlfriend, but, like, I couldn't do that alone. I wouldn't enjoy it. I don't know what I want to do. I know I want to do something big and important, make a change, but I have no clue really what that is.

It's interesting that you both felt this need to overachieve in your own ways. Where do you think that comes from?

In my head, I, like picture where I want my life to be. And like, I just sometimes tell myself, I know I'll be happy when I have that dream job and I have that wife that loves me and that family that I wanted in that house that's paid off and that maybe not sports car, but decent car. I'm not looking for anything crazy, but still, that's what I want.

But the irony, of course, is that you're using all of these conditions to do it. I use techniques that I learned which were conditional. Oh, if I do this, if I get this role, then that will take care of it. If I get this, that will be. If I find the right person, then I will have the perfect family. It was always looking ahead as opposed to right here and now. So I have to do all these things to get there. And that is a habit trail or a spinning wheel that is impossible to maintain your whole life. But as long as I was in the mindset of this and this, and this is going to make me happy. It didn't work. It didn't work. Happiness is very hard to achieve when you're conditioned to have to do something to get love.

Yeah, I live a lot in, like, what he was saying. You constantly tell yourself, oh, I'll be happy when I get this, or as I'm approaching this, I'll be happy. And yeah, I'll frequently say that, but I've been trying to be better about it.

Anthony, as a child, to learn that love is conditional, that's a really scary thing. Was it, until you became a parent, did you unlock this unconditional love?

It was directly related to being a parent. That's the miracle. Like, I found the strength to confront this man. When you're a parent and you experience that unconditional love, it changes you with.

The stigma and the fact that men typically don't disclose until much later in life. Could the number be.

Actually, we know it is different. That's just what's. I mean, David could speak to that.

It's a notoriously difficult area to study because there's actually a couple studies that have shown that even when you have documentary evidence that a man was sexually abused as a child, and you then ask them later in life if they were ever sexually abused, the vast majority of those men will deny it. Some have lost the memory. Most probably are just not willing to respond. So, as a researcher, I conducted many studies and found, you know, about one in six men were acknowledging that they had had some kind of experience that meets the definition of sexual abuse. And I'm absolutely certain that it is only, you know, some fraction of the actual number. What the actual number is, I can't even guess. It's greater than one in six, that's for sure.

The conversation about denial sparked a thought from Tyler's mom, Stacy.

You even said, had it not been for the discovery of the cameras in our home, he intended to take it to his grave. I mean, that was just his. His thought.

I mean, the plan was to get the hell out. I kept telling myself, next year it'll stop because I'll be older, I'll look more like a man. And it never stopped. And I just kept telling myself, I can push through high school.

You know, it's important to understand that the intensity of Tyler's need for purpose, it's the same as soldiers coming back from war. The experience in a war zone is so intense, you're frightened all the time. You see death, and it actually affects your brain. You know, your brain gets kind of reset to live on edge. And every second, every moment is charged with, you know, what if, what if, what if? And what do I have to do to survive this? When you live with the kind of daily fear that you lived with, you were in a combat zone.

Yeah.

You know, it's the same thing. And it really recalibrates your brain, and it takes, really a long time to sort of recalibrate again so that, yes, you could be in a situation where you are once again in that kind of a danger, but most of life isn't that way. It just takes a while to get to a point where your nervous system and your brain are kind of just a little bit more quiet. It's okay to just have a quiet day. You really were in combat, and you're coming out of it now.

Stacey was sharing something with me this morning about one of her concerns for you. Do you want to share a little bit?

A huge concern for me is when I start to feel that something's not okay with you, you're kind of quieter or things like that, and you tell me that you're okay. You're trained for so long to be quiet and to lie to everyone around you about what's going on in your world and how you feel. But I worry that there are times where he's telling me he's okay, and I'm still dealing with that child again, who's lying to me.

You're bringing up just a really important part of all this, too. Everybody's affected by this event, these traumatic events. Everybody who loves and cares about these individuals is affected. And in the same way that you have to give Tyler space for his change, he also has to. And you have to take the space for yourself as a parent to process what it is to feel that, oh, my God, why didn't I do anything? How come I didn't protect. And so you have to allow yourself, your healing in this process, because you can't only be good if Tyler's good. You have to be good unto yourself. But you can't make your happiness conditional on whether or not Tyler recovers. Yeah, because he's going to. And he is recovering.

It's worthwhile to remember from time to time that there's another part of the equation here, and that is that both of you were groomed. I've spent a lot of my career studying predators, and grooming is an integral part of these predations. And it's not just the direct victim who's groomed. We're in Boston here now, and I was here during the 1990 Catholic clergy eruption of cases. I interviewed a number of both victims of John Gagan, one of the most prolific predators and also the mothers of some of his victims. And Gagan was just a brilliant groomer, and he started by grooming mothers, which gave him access to the children. And he would then pick which one of the children, mostly boys, because he understood that boys are less likely to disclose. So you were both victimized by that grooming process, and that's something that you are still coping with. Yeah, everybody can be groomed. Everybody. What grooming is, is taking human trust and perverting it. It's almost impossible to detect it. And predators practice this, so they're not just doing this for the first time. They practice this over many, many years, and they get better and better and better at it.

So everybody is susceptible to it.

You typically hear from men that are much older than Tyler, can you talk about the impact of a conversation that's starting with a 19 year old on this public of a platform? What does that do to the overall conversation?

Well, Tyler, let me turn a question to you.

All right.

Let's imagine that there's a 15 year old boy who's in a situation like you were in. What would you say to him?

Probably tell him to listen to the podcast.

Good start.

I don't know. I'd probably tell them. It might seem like the end of the world, but it's not. I'm not gonna lie to you and tell you it's gonna be easy, but just like anything, you find ways to overcome it and it'll happen. It's possible. You just gotta want it.

And one in six.org has tools to help.

You can find not only therapists, you can find support groups, you can find peer support groups, you can find other survivors. What we are really focused on here is to confront and challenge the stigma that silences men, so that young men like Tyler here, who has the guts to come forward, we appreciate what you're doing, and we don't want you to be alone.

Like what he was saying, men definitely minimize because I was talking to one of my buddies a while back, and he was talking about how he had lost his virginity at like twelve. And all betrayal content, news and updates. We're grateful for your support. One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review betrayal. Five star reviews go a long way. A big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of glass entertainment group in partnership with iHeart podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Faison. Hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Kerry Hartman. Also produced by Ben Fetterman and Trey Morgan. Associate producers are Kristin Melcury and Caitlin golden. Our iHeart team is Allie Perry and Jessica Kreinchuk. Special thanks to Stacey Rutherford, Tyler, and the rest of Stacey and Tyler's friends and family, and to Anthony Edwards, doctor David Lisak, and the entire one in six organization.Audio editing and mixing by Matt Vecchio editing support from Nico Aruca Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines Music Library provided by MIB Music and for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeart Radio Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports every day. I'm bringing you the stakes, stars, stats, and stories to keep you updated. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect the teamwork, competition, and rivalries that we love to watch. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen to good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.Ever get the feeling someone's watching you? Well, in 1971, a group of anti war activists had that feeling.I was in the heart of the dragon and it was my job to stop the fire.So they decided to do something insane, break in to the FBI and expose J. Edgar Hoover's dirty secrets.We had some idea that this was pretty explosive.I'm Ed Helms. Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.In the early morning hours of September 6, 2016, St. Louis rapper and activist Darren Seals was found murdered.That's what they gonna learn. On for death, on for nothing.Every day Darren would tell her, all right, mom, be prepared. They are going to try to kill me.All episodes available now listen to after the uprising, the murder of Darren Seals on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.How do you solve a crime in reverse when you believe that someone was murdered but have no clue who the victim was? We have to do our job, and we have to find out who did they kill? If it's possible, how are we gonna do that? I'm Jake Halpern, and this is deep the nameless man. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.My name is Curly.And I'm Maya.And welcome to the Super Secret Bestie Club podcast.A super secret club where we talk about super secret things.Yeah, like secrets that are super.That's what it is.In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heartbreaks, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets.Get in here.Listen to the super Secret bestie Club on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

all betrayal content, news and updates. We're grateful for your support. One way to show support is by subscribing to our show on Apple Podcasts. And don't forget to rate and review betrayal. Five star reviews go a long way. A big thank you to all of our listeners. Betrayal is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of glass entertainment group in partnership with iHeart podcasts. The show is executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Faison. Hosted and produced by me, Andrea Gunning. Written and produced by Kerry Hartman. Also produced by Ben Fetterman and Trey Morgan. Associate producers are Kristin Melcury and Caitlin golden. Our iHeart team is Allie Perry and Jessica Kreinchuk. Special thanks to Stacey Rutherford, Tyler, and the rest of Stacey and Tyler's friends and family, and to Anthony Edwards, doctor David Lisak, and the entire one in six organization.

Audio editing and mixing by Matt Vecchio editing support from Nico Aruca Betrayals theme composed by Oliver Baines Music Library provided by MIB Music and for more podcasts from iHeart, visit the iHeart Radio Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, your one stop shop for the biggest stories in women's sports every day. I'm bringing you the stakes, stars, stats, and stories to keep you updated. If you're new to women's sports, welcome. And if you've been around, let's make things nice and comfy for our new friends. Good game is where we go to celebrate, debate, and dissect the teamwork, competition, and rivalries that we love to watch. Join us. Let's have some fun. Listen to good game with Sarah Spain on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Ever get the feeling someone's watching you? Well, in 1971, a group of anti war activists had that feeling.

I was in the heart of the dragon and it was my job to stop the fire.

So they decided to do something insane, break in to the FBI and expose J. Edgar Hoover's dirty secrets.

We had some idea that this was pretty explosive.

I'm Ed Helms. Listen to season two of Snafu on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

In the early morning hours of September 6, 2016, St. Louis rapper and activist Darren Seals was found murdered.

That's what they gonna learn. On for death, on for nothing.

Every day Darren would tell her, all right, mom, be prepared. They are going to try to kill me.

All episodes available now listen to after the uprising, the murder of Darren Seals on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

How do you solve a crime in reverse when you believe that someone was murdered but have no clue who the victim was? We have to do our job, and we have to find out who did they kill? If it's possible, how are we gonna do that? I'm Jake Halpern, and this is deep the nameless man. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

My name is Curly.

And I'm Maya.

And welcome to the Super Secret Bestie Club podcast.

A super secret club where we talk about super secret things.

Yeah, like secrets that are super.

That's what it is.

In each episode, we'll talk about love, friendship, heartbreaks, men, and, of course, our favorite secrets.

Get in here.

Listen to the super Secret bestie Club on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.