What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy.

Can we talk about this set? Mm-hmm.

Are you kidding? Alex. I know. I'm really happy about it. There's so many things I have to change. I know. I know. I see it because I'm a crazy person. There's certain things I need to- I would have changed those one flower that were in your last set.

I was like, I'm going to move those when I come over. No, I'm not lying. Because I'm- It was bad. It was just the one flower range that was always beside, behind you. And I was like, I just want to move that. When I go on our show, I'm going to... This is beautiful. You like it?

I love it. Good vibes.

I feel very serene.

Isn't this like you want to tell me all your secrets in this?

I mean, yes, that and the truth serum right here.

Okay, wait, let's start. Shay Mitchell, welcome to Call Her Daddy.

Thank you.

Shay made me a drink. What is in this drink?

Okay, this is passion fruit, Onda, but I made you a passion fruit spritzer. So I actually got passion fruit before coming over here. Just kidding, I lied. I got it delivered. I have two kids, okay? I love you, but thank you. So I had passion fruit, the guts of it. I put in one whole one and then over ice and then just passion fruit on to.

It's honestly really fucking good. It's good, right?

A little Spritz.

So I was told why I wanted you to drink. Why? I was told you were a lightweight.

That's crazy. And if that was Kate...

Let's Let's start. Okay, everybody listening, let me give you a little backstory. If you don't know who Kate Bailey is. Actually, this is what I was going to say. The only reason it's appropriate the amount of times that we've canceled on each other is because we have a mutual friend. Shay and I have been like, We're going to do it this month. We're going to do it. I cancel on you. You cancel it on me. I was like, It's good that we have a mutual friend. Her name is Kate Bailey. Kate Bailey. Kate Bailey is my publicist. Kate Bailey is your very, very good friend of how many years? So many. Obviously, we've met before, but we haven't hung out. Never. And I'm I feel like I already know you from Kate. Kate, every time she's with you is like, Shay is the most fun, outgoing life of the party. You're like, Stop. Oh my God. Keep going. She truly, all every time that she's with you, I feel like she's having the best time unless she's with me. And I'm like, why are you... What makes you so fun? What is your social life like right now?

Tell us. Oh my gosh.

What is my social life? I don't know if it's necessarily... I don't go out a ton, I say that, and then I was just at a concert last night until one. I think what it is is my perspective on things may be good. So even if Kate's stressed out, I am the opposite. I'm not stressed out. Or I feed off of people's energy, and I want to support you. I'm a real energy person.

I can get that from you immediately because we were just joking. We were like, Kate's always working on her phone 24/7. You're like, live in the moment, sweetie.

No, I'm super present. I will be super present. If we were out to dinner, unless there was something where I'm like, Hey, I have my phone because of my kids. But aside from that, I'm very big on living in the moment.

So another vibe I got from you is that before you met your partner, which we'll get into, I'm like, I fucking know Shay Mitchell was out there on the streets getting after it, dating, hooking up, having a good time. Tell me- Can we take a sip? Yeah, you're like, Okay, I'm going to chug this whole thing. What was your dating life like in your 20s?

My dating life was... I think I always thought about my life in ways of chapters to a book. I always said yes to things so that I could have that experience and be able to, I don't know, talk about it after. I do things for the experiential aspect of it. I get that. I want to add that to my chapter. I'm like, Oh, that'd be a fun thing. Oh, okay, if I hear, cool, let's try it. Or like, he does this profession, let's see what that's But as long as I was in control and it was my decision to do things and I felt comfortable, I was good to go. You were good to go. So I like, yeah.

Do you have a type?

Not at all. Not at all. I have zero type. Really? Zero type. If you were to look at the trajectory of my past, there is no type. It's a vibe. I love it. It's a vibe. It really is.

Okay, what vibe? What do you I need, though?

I need confidence, but not cockiness. And that is something. I need somebody who is respectful and a good human. And that's it. Truthfully, I feel like I've been in maybe I've experienced a couple bad ones. That's it. Out of a bunch.

I'm curious, if all of your exes were having a text thread, what is... You're like, Oh, God. Shay loves it. She's like, Oh, Okay. What are they saying? What do you think that they would be saying about you? Was there any theme after relationships?

She knew what she wanted. I think that would be the group chat. She knew what she wanted. That's what I think everybody would say. And I actually have really good... Again, aside from a few, I really have awesome experiences from my past, and they were great guys. We just weren't right for each other.

We all know you. Originally, originally, you popped off Pretty Little Liars. And I want to talk to you lightly about Pretty Little Liars because I can imagine... I don't want to say you're annoyed by talking about it, but that was 13 years ago. Yeah, yeah. So I'm sure in every interview you do, people want to talk to you about it. How does that make you feel?

A, okay. You know why? Because that's what gave me my start. And I will never forget that. And I will never look down on that. Pretty Little Liars was the biggest turning point in my life. I was doing bottle service before that. And when I booked this job, it changed my life forever. And it gave me the opportunities and the experiences that I've had. And I owe everything. I still talk to Marlene King all the time, and I'm Thank you for saying yes in that callback. It changed my life. I could never talk badly about it. And I love it. And I love when they do the spinoffs, and I'm always like, That's amazing. That's awesome. I love the fact that I was a part of so many people's lives in a really important part. For me, watching the OC, that was my thing. Gossip Girl, that was my thing. So when people come up and they're like, I loved you. I grew up with you. I'm like, That's awesome. And the fact that I got to play the character that I did is even more amazing.

Well, yeah. You have now played how many queer characters in your career?

Almost all of them. Maybe I was just meant to be. I'm a vehicle to tell their stories. But I also feel like I have never also put myself in a category. I am not one... I don't love a label. I don't love a title. I don't want to label my sexuality. I don't want to label my relationship. I never wanted to be a wife. I don't want to be put in category.

Why do you think that is?

I just want to be free. I just want to be me, whatever that is. Right now, I'm in a relationship with a man, and that's cool and it's amazing. But in 5 or 10 years, I don't know. Could be a woman. Could be. I never know, and I never want to put myself in a position where I feel constricted. Yeah.

Had you ever kissed a girl before you took on the Emily role in Pretty Little You Had? Yeah.

I had an experience before playing these characters. It wasn't like, Oh, I'm playing this character. Let me see how this feels. And that was the thing when people were like, How do you know how to play this if you haven't been in a relationship with a girl? Like, What? How do I know what it's like to... Somebody loves it. I hated those questions. And that's what I would always get. How do you know how it feels? Or how can you play this character if you're not a les... What? I don't know. I know what it's like to like somebody. It's the same shit.

Right. And I feel like we felt that in your character, where you are so confident in that role that I think it probably does help a lot of people watching you on screen being like, I want to be like that. I want to emulate that energy of just confidence in still such a hetero world that we're in. It's still not completely accepted, which is so fuck. And for you to be like, I don't give a fuck.

There's so much stuff that I do that's not accepted. I really obviously aren't... I'm not one to stand by tradition. Let's talk about that. Okay. Let's talk about that. My hands are freezing. You know what? I should have brought you my- Sure. Chug the whole...

Let's chug our drinks.

I need to chug it because...

Let's do a little chug.

Did you do a breakfast?

Mm-mm. That was a loud gulp.

Wow. I'm impressed. That's okay.

But you're not going to eat a pomegranate, are you?

No, I'm going to pour more into it.

I got it right here. Guys, I just knew Shay Mitchell, the media train queen.

Media train queen?

That's what Kate said to me. She was like, She's media trained. She I will swerve your questions. I'm like, Yeah, for the first 15 minutes, then I'm going to sauce her up. That's the complete opposite of what I'm supposed to be doing. I'm like, I'll just get her a little drunk, and then I'll ask her all the hard questions.

I love it. I also did say, Let's just tell everybody. There was no question. There was no topic that was off. You did say that. Right. Okay. Thank you. Okay. You're welcome. Okay. Wow. My hand is cold.

We should have gotten koozies.

Let me just put it on my thigh for a minute.

Okay. Let's talk about your relationship.

What one? No, I mean, what kind? Just joking.

You're slowly unbuttoning. I know.

What one?

Your partner.

When you were thinking about how you were going to ask me this, were you like, What do I call him?

Yeah. And you know what's interesting is I want to ask you, is the term baby daddy insulting to you? Because I feel like nick Cannon really has put a little downer on that one for everyone. No one wants to be called a baby daddy anymore. So it's insulting to you.

It's not insulting. Listen, it's not insulting. You don't love it. No, because he's more than my baby daddy. He's not nick Cannon. He's more than My baby daddy. And so I think that there is... I love the word partner. Some people don't. Some people don't love it. You're never going to please anybody. So let's just get that out of the way. Totally. For me, I like the term partner. He is my partner. He's my partner in a lot of things. He helps me so much with my business. Obviously, we're partners in raising our girls together. He's my partner in life that we're living right now, and I like it.

How does he feel about the term partner?

I don't know if he loves it. I don't know if he loves it. Sometimes he'll be on calls and he's like, And my wife, and I'm like, What? And I'm always like, not because I'm like, I want it. I'm like, Why do you think that is? Why? I don't like the word wife. Yeah. I don't know. I'm not. And he's not my... I don't know. I love... I think girlfriend is cute. And we met when I was 19, and I love that. We weren't girlfriend and boyfriend at that point. But I love that. I'm like his girlfriend. We are friends.

So you have two kids together. Two girls, yeah. But you met and you were friends first. Yeah, when I was 19. How did you transition from friends to relationship?

It's been a lot of years. I met him actually when I was doing bottle service at Drake's birthday. Drake's 21st birthday in Toronto. We're from Toronto. So I was doing bottle service there, and we met, and we didn't start dating right away. We were just talking. We found out that we were neighbors, and we started hanging out. I'd go to his basketball games. We just started hanging out as friends. And then we tried to make it work in more than a friend way. It didn't. We tried it a couple of times. It didn't work. And then we took some time apart. And then I think it was four or five years or something. And then randomly, a mutual friend just connected us together, and it was like third time's a charm.

When you started getting serious and even when you got pregnant, did you have to have a conversation with him to be like, I don't ever want to get married?

I think we had that conversation. Even when we were friends, I think I always spoke about my feelings. And I will never say, never say never about anything. But I just was never that girl who had a Pinterest board of her wedding. I never did. And my parents have been married for 38, maybe even 40 years, and they've had an amazing relationship. But it just wasn't something that I wanted. I didn't feel the need to... I didn't feel that a piece of paper and a big celebration in a ring would justify my love. It's more than that.

Yeah, no, no. But I like that you're saying it because I was sitting here thinking, I think there are some people when they listen to that of you are like, Wow, that much. It's so interesting and really crazy. And I'm like, If a man was saying that, they'd be like, Oh, he never thought he was going to get married. Like, okay, dope. I like that you're saying it, though, because it's really healthy to not just keep doing what the fuck came before us and not questioning it.

There is a trend because there's more people that aren't getting married now. Since the 1970s, I think it's like, A, the age is getting later on, which I love because I think similar to how we have to hit a certain age to drink and drive, we are developing so much in our 20s, and we are learning who we are. And when you get together and you're married, you grow as a unit. And sometimes that's great, but sometimes it's detrimental to your own development. Totally. And I think the reason why I've been very lucky to be in, for the most cases, great relationships is because I've always felt pretty secure clear and confident with who I was first before getting into a relationship. And I think that with marriage, sometimes you're more concerned about how you guys are both growing. You're trying to help him lift up. When at that point in your early 20s, you need to get your own self out. You need to figure out yourself. That's not to say that it can't work in your 20s. For all of those people, I love it and amazing. But I feel like for me, it just wasn't necessary.

And that's not to say that I don't believe in something. Hey, I'd love to have a a commitment ceremony maybe in, I don't know, 10 years, whatever. If it ever happens, I could look at him and be like, Hey, we should have a celebration because we just did that. Look at our girls. We're in high school. We crushed it. We went through storms, and we are here, and We were standing and we are standing, and we're like, high five because we just did that. Let's make a commitment to this family and to raising these girls or kids at that, whatever. But I would be all up for that because sometimes I think the celebration happens before Or you've even been through some storms.

I fucking love it because it's basically you're saying, do whatever feels good for you and we can make up new shit. Take a sip. Matt, That works with Drake. And when I think about that, he goes on tour with him, right?

Yeah. He's on his management team. A lot of the creative is from him. He's a creative genius, truthfully.

So he's Just in the world that is like, he's traveling, he's with all these people, there's parties, there's girls around, there's a lot happening. How does it feel or how do you handle when he's away and at these parties and at these events and you're sitting at home with the kids being like, I wonder what he's doing. And I'm not talking recently. Take me back to more beginning stages of building trust around this of lifestyle.

Yeah. I mean, it is 100 % hard. I can't be like, It's fine. I don't feel a thing. No, it's hard. But it's hard because I care. It's hard because I love what we have. You know what I mean? So, yeah, It's difficult. But then at the same time, we just talked and they're away in South America, and I'm like, Are you having fun? What are you guys doing? There's also that element because I feel like in the same way that I have with my friendships, those are so successful because I trust them and there's communication. And not that it's the same, but there's trust and there's communication with us. And it's not always perfect by any means, but there has to be trust. I can't think about other scenarios or think about hypothetical situations. If it ever were to come out or anything, there's dece, any of that, then I'll deal with it then. But I also can't live my life worrying about what he's doing. He is living his own life. We are two individuals that have come together and chosen to have kids together and have a family together. But at the same time, he is doing his own thing, and I love that for him.

He's having fun. He's crushing it. He's so good at what he does. And I love that he's with his friends getting to work and have fun. Totally. So I love that. But as long as there is communication, once that is broken for me, then it's done. And that's a known thing that we have. So as long as he knows that and I know that, I feel like we're good.

I Dated an athlete. I love how it's singular, plural. I dated athletes in the past, and I found myself in moments being the same as you of like, What do I give a fuck? I'm fucking sitting here with my girlfriends. We're having a great time, and he's going to do what he's going to do. But then there are the spiral moments. I remember I used to if he was in fucking Milwaukee or fucking Texas.

Texas or- Milwaukee. Yeah.

They always would go to the worst places. But that's when I know you're desperate. You're going to find some type of... So I would always be like, Oh, if they're going out tonight, I would spiral and look up the bar that I knew they were at. And then I would go to the Instagram, and then I would be like, Oh, who's at the bar? And if they tagged anyone, I would go to that girl's Instagram and look for him in the background and then be like, Oh, my God, there he is. He's standing next to that girl. He's really close to that girl. What's happening? And then I would text him be like, Hey, how's your night? It's a normal... I always used to be embarrassed to admit that. And I was like, I was in love with this person. I was in a relationship with this person, and I cared about this person. And I think jealousy and anxiety in relationships can be normal depending on the level of it. Sure. So I'm wondering, because this is a very public, touring-facing situation, how do you not spy viral in moments. And I don't even mean now.

I mean beginning. Oh my gosh.

No, no, no. For sure. Absolutely. I could not pretend. I did the exact same thing back in the day. I would say for sure in my 20s, I fully get you. I could do the It was the exact same thing. But it got to a point where I was like, Okay, so if he did, then what? Or if anybody at that point, if he did, then what? I'll be okay. I'll keep it moving. And it wasn't meant to be. But that is I live my life. And once you think about it like that, I don't want that then. If you can take him from me, then he's yours. I'm good, and I can keep it moving. Be there for my kids, or that's another story. But in terms of us, then our story ends, and that's okay. I still have my life to live. I cannot live my life like I did in my 20s because I did do that. And it's like, for what? I wasted so many sleepless nights. For what? Did that change how we acted? No. You're going to do, the guys, the girls, whatever. We're going to do what we're going to do, regardless if you're staying up at night, not sleeping, stalking an Instagram, he's still going to do what he's going to do.

He's not going to be like, well, Alex is probably up looking at the club's Instagram, trying to zoom into this. That's not going to stop him. So what does that...

You just lose sleep. You're so right. Okay? I'm not going to worry about it before it happens.

If you do it, then we deal and I'll figure out co-parenting. But then it is. And I hope you're happy. And I genuinely mean that. I want you to be happy because I feel like when you If you truly love somebody, you want them to live their happiest life. And I do. And if that's not with me, I don't want to force that.

I love this energy, too, because I feel like I've said this on my show. It's like, I know there's so many people. I always just say women because I know women listen to this podcast the most. So I'm like, Hi, ladies.

I think there's a lot of guys, too. You think? You have a video component to this. Let's be honest. No, they used to.

It's gotten a little too zappy that they're like, okay, there's no more full sex. You're talking about the dick going into the pussy. I'm fucking out. I'm like, okay, perbs. I think I've had a lot of conversations on this podcast trying to, when women write in, being like, I'm so in love with this person. And I love your advice, too, because I know Kate has always said, you are almost like the friend therapist. All your friends, go to you. And I feel similar with my friend group of you have to almost back out of it and look at it from a third POV of what would you tell your friend? And I feel like a lot of women listen to this podcast being like, Yeah, but Shay, I'm so in love with him. But I just have that feeling almost every time he's always doing boys' night. He's always out. And I just feel like I'm not fully a part of those moments. And I sit at home, but When we're together, our relationship is great, but he makes me feel really insecure. What do I do?

You need to be in love with yourself more, then. You need to love yourself more, because I would tell my daughters, You shouldn't be doing that. I don't want them having a million sleepless nights. A couple are fine. It's healthy. Whatever. We get it. But you shouldn't be feeling that way in a healthy relationship. And if you are, then maybe it isn't the right one. I don't want to constantly be living in a state of anxiety, wondering where they are, what they're doing. I actually love the fact that he's traveling with the biggest person, and you get to see all of that. And if you still come back, then I'm the baddest bitch. You know what I mean? That's what I feel like. And if I don't, then cool, go be with her, and then I'll keep it moving, too. It just wasn't meant to be. And I'm such a believer I feel like that's why my perspective on life and different experiences. If I miss a plane, I was like, Oh, there is a reason for that. That is how I live my life. Let me tell you, it's a lot more peaceful than what it was before.

I had this real realization about how it works for me and how it should be.

I love that advice, too, because I feel like it's half the time, more than half the time, we have to look at it like, It's actually not about him. You're sitting there like, why are you sitting there? Stressing. Why was I I'm on my phone zooming so intensely? Because I was bored in college being like, this is better than the guys I could be dating here. There's always if you break it down, I wanted to be with him because of the status and the money and the lifestyle, and I loved it, and I didn't want to lose it. And I was willing to maybe look the other way because I love that. Now, in hindsight, I'm like, that was perfect for where I was in that moment. I absolutely loved that moment in my life. Now, I would never put up with that because I want- No, because that time you could be putting into building yourself.

A, reading a book, educating And yourself going to the gym, hanging out with your friends, doing other things. I think as you get older, and the reason why I say, I did that all in my 20s, but it changed when I was 30 is because I realized how valuable every single day is. And I do not want to waste my fucking time stalking other people's movements. You know what I mean? Then I'm taking away my time and living my life and spending quality time with friends or people that are here watching somebody else's move. They're going to do it if they're going to do it. And I can't stop it. It's not healthy. It's not healthy. We We need to cut it out. It's too short. I don't want to look back in my life dedicating so many of my precious days to doing that.

Amen. So you're a mother. Yeah. I'm a mother. You're a mother. Did you always picture you were going Did you have kids?

Yeah.

Yeah, I did.

Okay. I never had a set age. I wasn't like, When I'm 26, I'm going to have... No, I knew that I wanted to experience that.

When you think about there's so many beautiful things that come with motherhood. Yes. But I feel like you're a good person to talk to about, because you don't like to label things, you're like, Absolutely not. When I think about motherhood Others. There's a lot of pressure if you're not just dedicating your entire life in other people's eyes to your children. Did you ever lose yourself in the beginning stages of trying to navigate being a mother, being also Shay Mitchell, this independent, successful woman that wants to have both?

Oh, my gosh. I remember when I was first pregnant with Atlas, and I was nine months. I was talking to my doula at the time, and all of a sudden we're talking, and I started bawling. And she's like, Oh, my gosh, are you so excited?

I was like, No, a piece of me is dying.

I'm going to be a mother. I'm now going to be a mom. And she was like, Okay, that's amazing. I was like, No, I'm a mom now. I'm a mother. She's like, Okay, amazing. Not understanding. And I think what I had to come to an understanding with is that, yes, Old Shay, a part of me, did have to be put to rest. I I'm a mother now. I wasn't beforehand. It does change. There's a leaf that turns when you get pregnant. From the moment you see that you are pregnant on that stick, it changes. That life that you lived before is over. And that's okay because there's a new life. There's a new chapter, a new relationship. It's fun and it's exciting. It's also scary. At that point, it was also a little bit lonely because your partner won't understand. They don't go through the same They don't understand the changes and the sacrifices that we make, especially being somebody who also was very active in my work and my social and everything. It was like, I have to take a pause. I was fortunate to be able to act up until the point where I was eight months.

But still, I had to take a moment. I had to take a break, whereas he didn't. And so that was really difficult for me when I was pregnant.

Do you have advice for someone that's currently having a a little bit of a difficult time finding their... Regaining their identity after they just gave birth? Now they've their kids alive and well, and they're like, Fuck, who am I independent of being a mother?

I think you need that time outside of your kids. I think it is so crucial. I love my girls. I will do anything, of course. It is like having kids truthfully is like having a heart live outside of you. My heart beats in in them. But I also need to continue to do things for myself and for me to feel rested, for me to feel like I've done what I needed to do, because then I'm a better mother when I can come back and I feel good. And I think that that's the thing. It is really hard, especially after. I always say I love a baby shower. I think that's great, even though I did mine at Magic Mike. What? I also think there needs to be another A postpartum like a mama shower after. Because it's all fine and dandy when you have that celebration when the baby's in your stomach and things are cool and there's a million beautiful flowers and friends and all of that around you. There needs to be something after when you're in the postpartum, when you're in the bed by yourself or maybe with your partner, in and feeling like a mess, feeling like if you're breastfeeding or you're feeding them with a bottle, you just don't feel your best.

There needs to be a celebration for you at that moment. I'm like, I want to start the mama shower. Or something where you have all your friends. I needed a flower crown then when the babies were crying, when Atlas was screaming, when the house was a mess. I need that. That group and party that.

I actually love that, too, because you're so right. There's such a celebration of right before, this is going to be great. And then life happens. And then life happens. And there's judgment. You're a very independent person. And I wonder, what does independence look like for you?

Independence to me means that... This is like ASMR because I'm crunching these passion for that. Is it?

Are you hearing that? Independence means that I can make my own moves and do what I want to do.

And when I want to do something, I do it. I don't know. Listen, let me tell you something. When I was... How old? I'm driving age. When I got my first car, my Parents got me a car. And I was so excited. Drove it around everywhere. Me and my girlfriends, I'd pick them up. As you do, you're like, just got my license. Let's drive to McDonald's. And then one day, I came downstairs, and I was like, Where are my keys at? And I couldn't find them. And I was like, Wait, hi, mom, dad, where are my keys? And he's like, You don't have your car today. I was like, Wait, why? Is it in the shop? Are you getting it washed? Are you filling it up? What's going on? He was like, You just don't have it today. I took it. And I'm like, Okay, so you want to drive it? Can I drive yours? What's going on? He's like, No, I bought it. I own it. It's mine. You don't have it. And I was like, Wait, what? You bought it? It's my car. He's like, It's not your car. I bought it for you, and I can take it away.

And I was like, I didn't even do anything. Then I'm trying to think. I'm like, Did I do something last night? Did he go through my... What is happening? Nothing had happened. He just took my car away because he wanted to prove a point that he bought it, and I didn't own it. And just because He had got me the car at that point. He could also take it away. And I was so annoyed by it. But then I also was like, You're right. He did buy it from me. But this is so fucking annoying. And from that moment, I was like, I don't ever want that to happen because I actually had to go somewhere that wasn't a drive-through. And I needed my car at that time. So I was like, Of course you did, Shay. Of course I did. I was like, I need to go to the mall. So I was like, I will never have that happen again. I'm going to own my shit. And that is what clicked in. There was a bigger message I was with that that was just really like, I need to own my shit because nobody can take that away from me.

Everything just feels better when I did that. I don't need somebody else to do that for me. And so I've always been super independent when it's come to that. If I want to go to dinner, I'm going to dinner. I don't need to wait for somebody to invite me or like... No, if I want that on the menu, I'll order it because I bust my ass to do that. And I think there's such a power. And with that, everything just tastes sweeter. It feels better. You rock it better when you're wearing that bag that you got. And again, gifts are nice, and I'll always take them, and I love that. So if you get that, good on you and amazing. However, I feel like independence gives you a freedom to live your life as authentic as you want it to be. I can do things that feel right to me without any hesitancy that like, Oh, so and so might not... Or, This may get taken away from me. Or, If I act this way, I'll get kicked out. No, I don't want that. I never wanted that. And I don't want my girls to ever do that.

You will be independent. You will own your own shit, and you will always have it. Nobody can take that away from you.

What you're saying is so empowering in terms of just like, you can't then be that affected by anyone other than yourself when you have that independence. And I think it's so important for young women to hear because when I was dating professional athletes or rich guys, in the moment, it felt so invigorating to me. And I felt like Alive. And I felt so powerful because I was attached to someone powerful. And then if they ended it, I was on the street with nothing.

Then you feel like back at square one again, and you're like, But wait, what happened?

And you look around and you have nothing. And so It's like, I'm also not even talking about financial shit. If you have your own shit in terms of, I know who I am. I'm stable with my fucking confidence and my personality. And if you fucking end it tomorrow, I'm still good. I'm still good. And I can carry on. Focusing on your independence, recognizing your worth. Because then when you fucking meet someone and you're like that, you're like- But having your own life outside of them, having your own friend group, having your own places that you go to.

You are so much stronger when you're two pillars holding something up than when you're trying to conform to one. You know what I mean? Just have your own life, I think, is so important. Totally. And then you're stronger, and then it offers up more questions. Then I can genuinely be like, What did you do today? Totally. Different strokes for different folks. Again, this is just how it is for me. I've also seen it on the flip side where it works, they work, and they have the same friends and all that, and that also works. I agree. This is just how it works for me.

No, and I think that's also I love this job because I get to just talk to so many different people that it's like, there is no right answer for anyone. It's like, you're going to find your own shit, but it's helpful to hear if some people are lost or just looking for guidance. You have a very specific way that you view life and the way that you view your worth and yourself and the way that you like to move. My question, though, for you is if I think- You always know there's going to be something juicy when you look at your head and you're getting real comfy now. No, I just like I ask this because sometimes it's helpful to humanize people in terms of you're so confident, but what is your biggest insecurity?

What is my My biggest insecurity? My biggest insecurity is... I mean, I can be in rooms. Just recently, I was in Paris, and I was I found a group of people that were speaking so many different languages, and I was like, Oh, my gosh, that is amazing. I feel like I could be spending more time educating myself instead of doing some other things. Maybe if I cut down some social media, I feel like I I could have learned another language. I get on myself sometimes for that, for education. So I'm like, Okay, I need to work on this. But then I download Word of the Day, and I feel like, Okay, I've done something. I'm trying. I feel like that's what... Yeah. I think every day there's different things. I'm not the most confident, most secure person. The reason why I sound like that is because I'm a big believer of saying things and manifesting and words being very powerful. You will never hear me say, Oh, gosh, I'm such an idiot, or like, Oh, dumb me. I don't speak like that. I don't ever say I'm starving. I don't ever say... I'm very careful with my words because They are very powerful.

And I am a big believer of manifesting. When I was doing bottle service, I had a cork board in my kitchen, had teen choice awards, it had Blake Lively and Gossip Girl, it had a white Range Rover, it had palm trees. A lot of that has come true, and I believe working hard in addition to just manifesting. But I am a very big believer of manifesting. And there's a difference with just saying, Okay, I will come into success. I will meet the love of my... No, no, no. You need to believe it, and you need to own it. And if that at the beginning is called delusion, then let it be, because I was delusional when I was doing bottle service. But when I was walking to your table asking you if you wanted Ketelman or Gregos, I thought I was the biggest actress playing a bottle service girl. And I walked with that and I walked in the snow in my eggs to the bottle service place, being like, bottle service place, to the lounge, being like, I own this. No, not today. I was an actress and I was living in the States and I felt it.

So delusional, manifesting, all of that. I'm a big believer of saying and putting out there positive energy. I don't know what the first thing was that you were asking me. Oh, yeah. So it may come off as It seems super confident, secure. But even Rihanna, that TikTok that was going around where she's like, Sometimes you don't feel confident. You just get up and you do it. You do. And you own it. And you have that. Because if you do and other people feel it, then you become that.

How the fuck did you become a bottle girl? Bottle Service? Bottle Service.

I wasn't a good bartender. My memory wasn't good. So bottles were easier. I could have my little thing. But bartenders, it was too many people ask me for too many drinks, and I never got it right. Also, I wasn't a good waitress. I'd forget things. Hostess crushed. I could always offer up a smile and take you to your table. But bottle service was just... It was fun. It wasn't fun. I actually hated going to it. No, I actually hated going to it.

I did it for one day, and then I went to bartending. Dude, what was like some... Do you have any memories of back in those days? Oh, my God. How creepy.

A guy slapped my ass and I broke his arm. No, I was not that person. And then I charged you like crazy, and I made so much money that night because that was not okay. I am not good in those situations. I'm not good being disres... Not that anybody is, but that, I will not handle disrespect.

I've heard through the great vine... Okay, hi. You really are such an incredible friend. And I think especially when you get to a certain age, I'm not going to say it's easy to be a friend in middle school, in elementary school, in high school. But there is something of that, you're all going through similar shit at that time. You're all in the same environment. And then when you get into your 20s and your 30s and your 40s and on, it is a motherfucker of being selfish of your own shit, being there for your friends. What friend are you?

I would have to say I'm a really good listener. I'm always there. If I hear in high school, if a friend of mine had a bad relationship with some guy did a wrong... Don't ever talk to me again, that guy. Do not come across me. I am a girls' girl. I love women. I really do because there's such a beautiful sensitivity and vulnerability to women, and I love that. I see it through all ages. And now having two little girls, I see it in them. But then I also see the fucked up part where I'm like, we're watching these Disney movies and everything is about finding your happily ever after with this prince. I'm like, it doesn't have to be like that. If you don't want to end up with a guy, you don't have to. If you don't want to end up in a relationship at all, you don't have to. I'm constantly doing this because I'm like, hey, she loves this princess life, which I want her to live. But I'm also like, this is fucked up when I'm watching this. Happily ever after doesn't mean you always have to end up with somebody.

It doesn't always mean you have to have kids. I always forget what I'm talking about. What was the January? What friend are you?

No, this is great.

Okay, So on the friend level, my friends are my family. They are. I have a very small group of friends. I have a lot of acquaintances. I love people, too. But I have a very small tight knit friends who I feel like they are my family, and they've just held me down. And why I feel like I can be the way that I am, it's because I have such a solid support group of people, and they are there for me no matter what. And I feel that they are like that because it's a two-way story. I am there for them as well. And if anybody needed me, any of my girls, I will be on that plane. I don't care. I will be there for you because life is crazy and it's wild. And sometimes you need me more than I need you. And sometimes I need you more than you need me. And so it's a beautiful relationship. It's like a teeter totter of... I don't know. It's a teeter totter. I just feel like that is how my friendship is with people.

Women go through it in their 20s of losing that friend group that maybe they had in school and feeling almost ashamed if they don't have the big friend group and they don't have all of the big... Can you talk about that a little bit? The cattiness of women being like, Oh, she doesn't have that many friends. Or she doesn't Because I have people write in all the time that are like, I have two really good friends, but I feel bad that I don't have this big group.

No, babe, if you're blessed, you have two solid friends. No, we do not compare ourselves to a movie. We do not compare ourselves to other people. You have no idea what's actually happening. A girl could have 15 solid friends. You don't know if they're all talking shit about each other. If you have two solid friends, that's amazing. And own that and be thankful you have that. I have my childhood best friends, and the amazing part is that I talk to them the least out of everybody else. My best friend, I talk to her once every three months, and it doesn't even matter. I pick up, I talk to her, and she's like, Cool, we got it. She gives me what I need. I give her what... And I'm like, boom. I didn't even talk to her for the past three months.

And you do your quick run down, what's going on in your life. And that's it.

We catch up. I have no photos with her. It comes time to be in her birthday, and I'm like, I have no photos with her. We never take photos. Those are the best relationship. But that's it. When you have the best night of your life, you're not taking photos. You forget. And that's the same thing with your friends. It's like, yeah. But I mean, I have a lot of photos with Kate.

So like, Kate, you're also- Kate's the lowest of your friends. She's like, wait a minute. We have thousands of photos together.

It's all fake, bitch. You're on the periphery, bitch.

You're not on the inner core.

But even with my solid group of friends, I go to them for different things. Same with... What the fuck? Title of the seven. But I have different friends that I go to for different things. And I think that's a beautiful thing.

No, I love that you said that because just at my engagement party, my three best, best friends from childhood were there. And then I was talking to my friend Kristin, who has literally been there since I don't even remember what age. And I was like, I don't think we have more than three photos together. And we do the same thing where it's like, every four months we're like, hello. And I'm like, okay, go. And she gives me the rundown. And that is, I think, should be more normalized. You don't need to talk to someone every fucking day. You don't also need to feel like you need 15 people around you because that also usually means who's your one? Everyone knows who their best fucking friend is, or their three or their four best friends. I just think it's important to normalize because all these... I feel like women online are shaming of... She doesn't seem like she is friend. I know, but they're shaming of everything. It's literally everything.

When their lives trying to appease everybody, that would be so exhausting.

No, you're right.

If you are happy and you are good with your life in your circumstances, regardless of if they go against the norm, then you're crushing it.

Tell me about a time that you had to end a friendship.

Oh, my God. I ended a friendship because I stopped respecting her. Truthfully, I didn't respect certain decisions she made. And I think once you lose a respect in any relationship, it's over. And I don't know if that's the Aries in me. Probably. I follow this account that's Aries facts or something. And every time they post, I'm like, Fuck, that's so true. That's me. I am an Aries. But yeah, it sucked. We were friends for a long time, and it got to a point where I just... You know when you're with a guy, you're dating a guy, and you see something that's so unattractive? It could be anything. It could be, I don't know, his hands or hair in a certain place, and you're just like, and it's done. You can't unsee it. Can't unsee it. That was the same thing with this. I couldn't unsee this one part, and it was over. And I never looked back. It It happened, and we had a good amount of years together as friends, but I had to cut it. Again, life is too short. I have a very limited amount of time that I get to spend with people, and I want that to be quality over quantity.

And you're either in or you're out. And same thing with me. Who's to say? Her life isn't better without me, but whatever. It's just it wasn't meant to continue. And that's okay. People come in and out of a life. It's like, look at Seasons. That's a Same thing with people. Have them come in. You learn different things about each other, and then you continue, and that's okay.

I love that, too. I feel like there's such, again, stigma for women of the bitchiness and the friend loss. And it's like, I get so many questions about this all the time. And I'm like, if you had a great thing for a certain amount of time that gave you something in your life and vice versa, and it ended, that's okay. Because I know then you go to a new part of your life where you have kids and you meet friends through your kid's parents. And it's like, you're always going through new iterations of your life. And welcome it. Exactly.

Be open to it. The unknown is so exciting.

No, I agree. Okay, we needed advice. I figured I'd be like, Okay, let's talk about some situations, hypotheticals. Okay. Number one, what would you tell someone who opens up Instagram and sees the person that they're dating out partying at a club at 2:00 AM, and they haven't heard from that person all night? I think we talked about this.

Yeah, but what's your boundary? For us, it's like, Hey, I always just want to know when you're safe and bad. I don't need a photo. I don't need a FaceTime, but just a text. And also we have two kids. I want to know around the area of what you're doing so I can be like, if anything were to happen, I don't want to be like, I don't know where he is. Tell me the country you're in. Maybe the hotel would help. I don't need to know anything else. But I need to know certain things. So it depends what your boundary is. Did you set it so you're like, Hey, I want to hear from you in this amount of times. Or is it okay if they text you when they go to bed? What's your boundary? So it depends on that.

I agree with you because I think I remember in the beginning of dating Matt, he was like, You just have to send me a text when you get in bed. I just want to know you're alive and at home. And at first I was like, That's being clingy. And then afterwards I was like, Oh, wait, I get what he's doing. He's actually respecting. Have the best night. I just want to know you're safe. That's it. I'm like, What a great boundary. That's it. But if you're so triggered by seeing him on the Internet of stalking him again, I go back to that version of myself. That's your first real red flag to be like, Why are you so stressed? Because that's probably you know he's actually doing something shady. Totally. I don't have a doubt in my mind right now with the partner that I'm with that I'm like, nothing. But with other relationships, I'm like, I knew. We always fucking know. You always in your gut fucking know. I truly believe it. If there's certain shit that they're doing, I think most of the time you do.

You do what they're having the odd cases- True. That you're like-where some people may not have. And that's okay, too. Then I mean, yeah, that's okay, too, if you don't expect it. True.

But I also think it's like having the confidence and the self-respect to if this is bothering you so much, tell him. Say it. It's like you're not being needy or clingy. It's like if you're in a relationship and you're like, Hey, babe, it really upsets me. I realize I get so triggered and anxious when you're out and I don't hear from you.

But think about what it is about that. Because just being out as a human, I mean, I go out. I come back sometimes at 2:00, 4:00, 6:00. So it's like, what about that is bothering you? Is it that you think there's other girls there? Is it that he hasn't told you where he's at? Ask yourself and then have that conversation.

And then if there's shit that it's like, well, because he does this all the time and he cheated once. Well, then... Okay.

And then reassess the situation. But just being out, I mean, we're humans. We got to go out. We got to go out. And also, I love it when I'm like, Do you go out there? I was like, Hot girl. I want you to see that. I don't want to keep you in a little room with blindfold on.

Every time- Again, please go out there and see. It's so healthy to have your partner go out. Every time Matt goes out and he comes home, I'm like, Okay, tell me everything. And I'm laying in bed high. I'm like, Oh, what happened? And he's like, This person was there. This ex was there.

No, he tells me. Even when we've been out, there have been girls that have come up and been like, Oh, my gosh, he's so I'm like, Thank you.

Yes, absolutely. Because he doesn't wear a ring.

No. And you don't wear a ring. But also, if you wear a fucking ring, does that deter anybody? Does that deter them? Does that deter... No, it doesn't do anything. Sometimes it's more attractive. Look, go out, Live your life. Be free. If you come back, awesome. If you don't, we'll figure it out. Peace. Peace. I don't have time for that anymore.

Okay, let's say someone wants to approach their partner about an issue in their relationship that they're insecure about. What advice would you give them in approaching this topic? So you're going to someone, you're like, I'm fucking insecure about this. I want to talk about my part about it. They're nervous.

Rightfully so. But also, I feel like I've had this so many times where I've been so vulnerable, and I can't be any more vulnerable. He knows. And I think that's okay because the right person will accept it and take it and hear you. The wrong person might run from it and then let him run. It may They seem like I'm like, Let them go. Let them free. But also like, yeah, because if it's the wrong person, why do you want to waste your time with them anyways?

Dude, my mom always said it, and I remember in the early days of my show, I would always say this. My mom would always be like, and at first it was friends, because when I was younger, my mom would always say, Why would you want to be friends with someone that doesn't want to be friends with you? No. You won't hold them down? Same thing with relationship, right? You're like, Why would you want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with you or doesn't respect Back to you. It's like, answer the- You don't.

You don't. But that's also why my whole thing, and again, love it for everybody else. But the whole concept of, We need to have a bachelor party, or a bachelor party, because this is the last night of Freedom. What? No, you can have all of those nights. You want to go at Timmy, Tony, John, and Frank all day long, you can go. I'm not holding you back. That'll never be the life that I live, where you feel the need that your last...

I hate I hate that. Dude, you're so right. Okay, we need a little teeth. Tell us about some drama you've ever had in a relationship. All of this is like, Shay's got it all together. No, it's not. No, not in a bad way. But it's like, You have it all together right now in terms of how you think about shit. Give us your 20s. Give us a fucking story about Shay not having it together and a relationship.

I mean, in my 20s. I think in your Again, it did really change for me in my 30s. I will say I feel good now. But no, in my 20s, all my friends would be like, Wait a minute. Sammie has been there with me through thick and thin, and she knows those times where she's had to sleep over and I'm convulsing into a paper bag. I'm like, he did this. I've had those moments a thousand %. But sometimes I think I brought them on me because I'm dramatic and wanted to experience that. I don't know if I was listening to a song and I was like, I can't Let's relate to this. Let's relate to this. And then I'd go out and cause shit because I was like, I'm telling you, that tattoo is white, not because I wanted to get it for you to see. I wanted to feel it. I am that person where I want to feel it. So I wanted to cause shit sometimes, and I would. And that was just me experimenting at that age. So I had so much drama in my life, and I would do things that would put me in situations where I'm like, Oh, that wasn't fair.

But let's see how it rides out. And then that's going to be a story to tell. And yeah, I did it because I wanted to be able to have that story.

No, I get that. I relate to that in a lot of ways of just being like, Do it for the experience.

Or you're listening to a song and you want to put your hand on the window when it's raining, too, and sing out to it. Sometimes I wouldn't feel that way, but I wanted to. So I would go and set that situation up for myself. You know? It's like, I did that.

It's so good. No, I relate to that. And then on top of it, I then started a show where I did talk about my life. So I was like, I need a fucked up story. Like, let's go out. I get it. I think that's in a weird way. I think it's healthy because then you do experience shit where you're like, I don't want that. I want this. Looking back on your single days, what's one piece of dating advice you can give my listeners straight from the Shay Mitchell playbook? Oh, my God. Something you haven't said yet to all the single ladies?

I don't know. I feel like, listen, if Madden... I feel so happy with the way that everything turned out. Because if we had been together from the moment that I met him, I don't know if I would be completely content and happy right now. I would have wondered. My mind would have drifted. And that's not to say it doesn't drift. We're humans. But I got to live out a lot of different experiences, and I had a lot of fun. I loved that. I thought that these were the years where I will be able to do this. And you can still do it later on when you're married, blah, blah, blah. But it was fun. It was fun to go out one day with this guy and then another with this guy as As long as I was in control, like conscious control, all of that, it was on my terms, I loved it. I thought there was nothing wrong because I learned so much about myself through each of these relationships. And that's what I loved. I was like, Okay, if I date this person, I wonder how this would be. Well, let's find out.

Let's see how I can deal with his lifestyle. Let's see how I can deal being taken on this way. I loved learning about myself through other people.

I think that's such good fucking advice, and we almost can end on that one of like, when you are in your single part of your life, it's such an opportunity to get to know yourself better. And it's like, there's such a pressure, I think, for women to settle down and have kids and start your life. And it's like, just make sure that you know yourself before you pick that person. And that's where you're saying, and I feel the same way of, I've gone through so many things that I wouldn't have been able to be with my partner now had I not been through all that shit. So sometimes you have to put yourself into weird fucking situations. If you're sitting at home being like, I haven't been going on dates. Listen to Shay, put yourself out there, create a scenario. Even if you get the fucking story, it's ending up creating a better version of yourself because you're going to learn what you like, you're going to learn what you don't like, and you're going to be invigorated to find the next story, find the next thing for yourself. So you can look back and be like, Holy fuck, I lived it.

I did it. And then when you find the right person. There's no doubt in your mind it's the right person because you've been with so many different people in different settings. I don't mean sleeping. You've fucked so many people. But it's like, you know your shit of like, I don't like that. I like this. And you're a kid in a candy store of like, you know what you prefer.

You know what you want and what you don't want. However, don't just date anybody. Always have that self-respect. And that's why looking at my past, I can say, like I said, besides a couple out of them, I always had that respect. And that's important. Don't just date a loser to date loser. We don't need to experience that.

No, we really don't.

We always know the outcome on that. But if you can go into a respectful relationship, hook up, whatever with somebody, then do it. Experience it, explore it, and learn about yourself. Now is the time.

Is that it?

I don't know. I feel like once we turn this off, she keeps it rolling. I'm like, Keep rolling.

I know. No, I do think this is in an odd way. But that is the thing.

It's even having two daughters, I always look at it like, what would I say to them? I, yes, talking about even thinking about that right now, and they're so, fuck, yeah. But if you are going into a relationship and experience with self-respect, you know that that person has respect for you. You are aware, you are conscious, you are all of that. Then I think there is no harm in that. You are learning about yourself through that. And I love that. I wouldn't take away the experiences that I've had. And the other thing is, I would never take away the experiences that my partner has had. I don't talk shit about any of the people he's been with because all of those people that he was with made him the person that he is today. And sometimes I'm like, well, I wish you could have had a couple.

It's so true.

I never talk shit about that because thank you.

The last thing that I would like to say is I feel like this episode also It sounds easy, but no, it sounds easy, and it seems hard, but it really is easy where you were talking about if you're not being treated right, if you're not feeling right in a relationship, If you're listening to this and you have a pit in your stomach right now because your partner is doing something, if you're questioning certain things, if they're not acting the right way, if they're not treating right, that's it. That's your answer.

That's your answer. Life is too short. And you only recognize that when you're in a moment where you realize that, which doesn't happen for all of us. But it's like, I don't want to wait for that moment when it happens to be like, Oh, shit, I should have done this differently, or why did I waste those days? Or those sleepless nights worrying about this. It didn't do anything. It doesn't do anything. So live your life how you want to live it. Don't worry about somebody else because your worrying isn't going to change the outcome. It's not going to change the outcome. I can promise you that. They don't care if you're worrying or not. Live your life. Do what makes you happy and do what you love. Do what makes you happy. I don't want to waste any more days. I did that enough in my 20s, like I said. But for those listening who are in their 20s, save yourselves, learn from us, and don't waste your days worrying about somebody else. Let them be.

God bless you.

What's that quote? If you love something, let it go. It comes back, it's yours. It's the same thing. Every day he comes home, I'm like, Hey, there you are. You know what I mean? But you don't have to. Hey, you're back. Hey, can you put her to bed? You know what I mean? But that's how it is. And I think there's something so romantic about that. And I always say, I think it was Charlie's Theron that said this in a quote, where if you come home because you want to, not because you feel like you have to, then you'd have to call the lawyers and do all. I think there's something so romantic about that. We don't need anything else to define our love or our relationship at this moment. We have two beautiful girls. We are very fortunate to have the life that we live, and we recognize that. And if that ever were to change, then we'll deal with it. But nothing that I can do, or especially signing the paper or getting the... Confirms that. We confirm it. You confirm it in your relationship. And don't let societal public pressure, parental, religious, deter you from doing what you feel is right.

Shay, thank you for coming and calling her daddy.

I mean, thank you for having me.