Want to bring in New York Times senior political correspondent and CNN's political analyst, Maggie Haberman, because I think the question is, we see all the Trump legal team, what they're saying, but how is Trump himself viewing the multiple efforts that have been playing out? Two of them now successful, at least for now, to get him off.

The ballot. Look, what he's saying publicly is actually not that different than what he's saying privately to people, Kaitlin, which is that this is undemocratic. This is an effort to... It's election interference. As we know, he is very good at projecting what he is accused of back onto other people. And it's not surprising that he's doing this here. He's not happy about this. It is true that a lot of people around him see this as politically helpful, but it's also yet another front they have to fight, and that comes when they're fighting any number of them.

Yeah. Are they worried at all about the point that Norm was making there, which is that a Secretary of state, even if she is a Democrat, the Colorado Supreme Court, the January sixth Congressional Committee, all of these positions of authority are putting in writing that they do believe he was not only responsible for what happened that day and started it, but he fanned the flames.

Of January sixth. Anything like that coming from an official source is not great for him. He knows that, his folks know that. It's not good for him long term, I should say. It's not good for him, certainly if he has kept off the ballot. That is just logistically problematic. But while this is fuel for him in a Republican primary, if he is the nominee in a general election, this is just objectively not a helpful fact set. It will be used in ads, it will be used on mailers, it will be said at Democratic town halls over and over and over again. There will be officialdom to point to saying that Trump did it. This is what didn't happen with the Senate trial for impeachment. This is what didn't happen for almost two years from the DOJ. Now there is something that is quasi-official, even if it's coming from folks who are arguing a partisan. It's just not helpful to them.

Does he seem confident at all that the Supreme Court, if they do choose to get involved here, will rule in his favor?

His folks believe that they are going to rule in his favor, but he is never certain that anything is going to be the case until it's done. He's been railing about this Supreme Court for years now, because despite the fact that he appointed three of the justices, they have not shown much interest in his election cases or his election efforts. And so he doesn't really see them as consistently being with him on any of those issues, and he doesn't have certainty that it will go his way. However, a lot of people he listens to do think that this is likely, the Colorado decision certainly is likely to get shut down, and that the Supreme Court is going to have to take this up because it's clearly going to be other states now.

Well, and to that point, I think that there are people who don't like the way the court has tilted since the three justices he's put on there. But when it comes to the powers of the presidency and what he's had, they have had less of an appetite, as you wrote in your reporting last week, for.

Supporting him on that. Absolutely. They have shown really very little appetite for getting involved in this. They did after Election Day in 2020. There has been no sense that they are moving faster. They did not move quickly on the immunity question, which Jack Smith, the special counsel, was asking them to do. There were no dissents on that, but that doesn't mean they won't take it up at a later date.

Yeah, we'll wait to see what they do. Maggie Hereman, thank you for that.