So let's focus on what makes for good relationships. And let's start with what relationships do you need in order to have a good life? Yeah.

Okay. So there's a bedrock relationship type that everybody needs, which is who has my back? So we asked our study members at one point, who could you call in the middle of the night if you were sick or scared. And most people could list several people in their life. Some people couldn't list anybody. And some of those people were even married, and they didn't list their spouse. So we think that everybody needs one person. In my world, we call it a secure attachment to another person, where you feel like if I'm in trouble, that person would be there for me.

We've talked about it on this podcast as your 4:00 AM friend. Yeah. The person you can pick up the phone to at four o'clock in the morning, whether it's an emergency or you're just lonely and you need somebody to talk to. Yeah. Why does secure attachment matter and what Is it? How does it relate to happiness?

Secure attachment refers to this idea that we all bond when we're babies, when we're tiny, we bond to caregivers. And that if the bonding goes well, we end up believing that we are lovable and that there's somebody there to love us. And that when we believe those things, we grow up happy and we grow up brave enough to explore the world. Because there's a home base we can come back to. Sometimes you'll see on a playground, you'll see a parent with a two-year-old, and the two-year-old totals off. And then at some point, they'll run back and they will grab the parents' leg. It's sometimes called refueling, where they're reminded, Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, all the way through life. So how do I take a risk in my life? You may have someone in your life, maybe it's your spouse. And if you start to take a risk, like starting a new podcast, you might run it by him and say, What do you think? Do you think I could do this? We need somebody to say, It's okay, and I'm here. Even if it doesn't go well, I've got your back.

I feel like that's the whole purpose of this podcast for the person listening. Yeah. That it is a refueling. Yeah. That it's a place you can come back to, like a home base and hear somebody who really means it say, You got this. Yes, you can.

You can. Exactly.

One of the findings of the study is that your relationships not only create a good life, but they actually make you healthier. They make you live longer. And so can you talk a little bit about how the connection that you feel With people in your life or even warm connections with strangers helps you manage stress?

Yes. I mean, there are a bunch of ways it does that. One is it makes us feel we're not alone, and feeling like we're not alone is vital. Feeling like someone will catch me if I fall. Feeling like we belong. It's one of the reasons why feeling part of a group matters. It's why being excluded from a group is so painful. We need to feel like we belong to feel good about ourselves. So even the small interactions we have, like when you go into the coffee shop and you have a nice exchange with the barista who makes your latte, is that moment of connection where, yeah, how's your day going? And sometimes people will actually tell you how their day... They'll really tell you, not just on automatic pilot. And that that helps us feel like we're with someone else and we belong, and we're seen by someone else.

Can you talk a little bit, based on the research, of why these small moments and these small conversations, even with a stranger, throughout the week, really are an important part of living a good life?

What we know is that those conversations with strangers, again, help us feel connected, help us feel affirmed. They did an experiment in Chicago where there are a lot of commuters on the Chicago commuter rail system, and they assigned some people to do what they normally did on their commute, which is to look at their phones or read a book or whatever, listen to music. And the other people were assigned to talk to a stranger. And they asked people, How much do you think you're going to like this assignment? And the people who were told they had to talk to strangers thought they were not going to like it. When they completed their assignment, they were all asked, How do you feel now? The people who talk to strangers were way happier than the people who just sat and did what they normally did on their commute. And it seems that the connections we make are energizing much more often than not. Yes, sometimes we can get into a conversation we don't like, but more often than not, it's like, Oh, it's nice. It's nice to say hello to you. It's nice to complain about the weather together.

Whatever it might be, it just makes me feel like I belong.

This is something that I have always done. I always said it was because I grew up in the Midwest, just very friendly. I just am always talking people. I'm always saying hello to people. I'm the person that gets onto an elevator. We're staying at a hotel, and there is this big electrical conference there. And so we get into the elevator yesterday. It's probably 7:30 in the morning. It is full of, just imagine a group of seven electrical contractors. Get that picture in your mind. They're all standing there quiet. I'm like, Hey, guys, what's up? And first, silence. Who is this? Yeah. And I'm like, How's the conference? And they're like, Oh. And then one guy starts to talk, and then All of a sudden, like popcorn popping. Next thing you know is we're going down the 17 floors. We're chatting it up, and I'm recommending the almond croissant at the bakery and the cafe. I love that. And I realize that It's not even about being extroverted because I'm really more of somebody I'm realizing who's more ambroverted. I'm extroverted at work, but then I'm literally a I never leave my house thing. But I am so energized by it.

Right. So how did you feel at the start of the elevator ride and then at the end? Can you compare?

A thousand %, I compare. As I got out of my hotel room alone and I'm checking my phone as I'm walking down the hallway, and then I'm turning right to walk down the other long hallway, and I'm still on my phone, and I'm thinking about my work day, and I'm trapped in my head, and then I walk over to the elevator, and then I hit the button, and I'm so not present that I step on the first elevator that dings and it's going up, not down. So then I go up alone in the elevator for another seven floors, and then the first contractor walks in. And the second I looked at him and I said, Good morning. And he smiled and said, Good morning. I felt a little burst of energy. It was like I was immediately now in the moment and not on my phone. I was now present with another human being staying at the same hotel. The door shut. And as we start to descend, I turn, I'm like, Were you in the elevator with me yesterday morning? And he laughed. He's like, I don't think so. And I'm like, Well, you probably would have remembered it because I was yapping with everybody in the elevator.

But there was somebody in there, and then the doors open, and now we're talking. And so then somebody else gets in. And I say, Good morning. And then the guy looks up, Good morning. And then we stand in, and then the doors open again. And so as everybody then starts to get on.

You were the greeter.

Yes. But the energy in the elevator shifted. Nobody was on their phone. And we didn't solve the world's problems. But even just getting off the elevator And then as I asked her to have a great day, everybody. And a couple of people, Hey, you too, thing. I was present. I felt a little less alone. I felt I felt a lift of life force energy from other people. It shifted my mood, and it changed the day.

And what you've developed is a habit of doing that. And what is worth pointing out is that it's a habit we can develop, that even though it's a little awkward at first, if you just keep doing it, it'll become second nature. But I had to develop the habit.

Yeah. And I think it's really important to I want to note something that this is really important because you underestimate how big of a difference it makes in your life. I'd like to offer one other example of how you can do this, because I know that for a lot of people, striking up a conversation or making small talk feels either scary or trivial, and it's not. What I've noticed about making this a habit of creating what you and the research I have found are, quote, warm connections and these small social day-to-day interactions is that I notice that I would rather feel the way that I felt When I got off the elevator this morning at the hotel, having just chatted and saying good morning to people in the elevator, I'd rather feel that tiny little buzz and lift in my mood than the way that I feel when I'm standing there lonely, looking at my phone, waiting for time to pass by, that I have realized that I have a choice about the experience in my day-to-day life that I can create for myself. And so another way to do this is you probably go to a coffee shop most weeks and simply complimenting somebody either on their nails or the shirt they're wearing or how good the coffee looks.

And then after doing that three or four days in a row saying, Do you mind me asking what your first name is? I feel like I come in here every day. I see you. I don't even... I'd like to just... I'm Mel. And then here's a pro tip. When you turn around after you say their name, write their name in your contacts in the notes under the entry for the coffee shop. And as you pull in tomorrow morning, if you're like me, you will forget That Evan is the dude that is at the coffee shop at the hotel I stay at all the time in Boston. I now know his name. He knows my order because I use this and I refresh my memory the first couple of times. So when I walk up, I'm like, Oh, it's Evan, right? Oh, I'm Mel. It's great to see you again. That that small thing, as crazy as it sounds, it makes me less lonely. Absolutely.

And it makes the other person feel seen. Evan feels like you see him. You're not just doing some transactional thing. It's like, I see you, and I'm glad we're here together.

And here's the other piece, if I could take it to an even more profound level. Every one of us wants to create more meaning in life, and you want to feel like you have discovered this deeper sense of purpose. And I will go to my grave knowing that I feel that my life is more meaningful, and I am experiencing it at a deeper level, simply because of this one habit of forcing myself to create these warm, simple connections and conversations with strangers as I go about my day. It's almost like being tethered to a mooring that keeps you present in life, that keeps you able to ride the waves and locate a sense of energy and goodness as you go about your days, no matter where you are. I don't even know if I can get through the opening of this. I literally am so excited for today because... Over and over and over again, living a good life is about the things that are right in front of you that you're not seeing.

What's the strongest predictor of who's going to be healthy and happy at age 80 when we look at age 50? When we looked.