Labor are continuing their efforts to convince voters that they'll revive the economy and deliver growth if they win the election. Well, I'm joined now by West Streeting, the Shadow Health Secretary. Very good morning to you. Thanks very much indeed for talking to us this morning. Let's talk about your manifesto, launched yesterday, of course. In it, you say that you're going to raise taxes by around £8 billion. And yet you and Labor have been very critical of the very high level of taxes under the Tories, and yet you've got no plans to bring them down, but instead putting them up.

Honest for some time now about the state of the economy that we will inherit if we win the next general election and the recklessness of the Conservatives economic policies and the hard choices that this is creating. Where we've set out plans to invest essentially in things like our National Health Service to cut waiting lists, in neighborhood policing to cut crime, and in our schools to cut teacher vacancies that see kids talk subjects like GCSE Maths without Without a teacher qualified in the subject at the front, we've spelled out fairer ways of funding those choices than the Conservatives who've always sought to pick the pockets of working people as their first and last result. It's things like clamping down on tax avoidance, making sure that we close the remaining non-DOM loopholes, a real windfall tax on the big oil and gas companies. Those are fairer choices. When it comes to the burden of taxation on working people, we've been very clear we're not going to put up income tax, national insurance or VAT. You are right to mention we've got to get our economy growing again because if the economy had grown under this government at the same rate as the last Labor government, there are tens of billions of pounds available to either invest in our public services or to put back in people's pockets.

That's our ambition if we win the next general election.

Okay, and I want to come on to growth in a moment. But first, you talk about wanting fairer funding, but you do accept, don't you, that under a Labor government, there would be the highest tax burden in history?

I already have the highest tax burden in history. It's Rachel Rees' ambition.

And it's going up further under you.

And going up even further under the Conservatives. We've got tens of billions of pounds of unfunded spending commitments in the Conservatives Manifesto, which, if enacted with more borrowing, would see interest rates rise Liz Trust mini budget on steroids, families paying about £4,800 in higher mortgages, which would inevitably also mean higher rents for people. We can't allow the arsonist to be given back the matches to finish the job. We've got a serious plan here. We've to get the economy growing again. With things like building one and a half million more homes, things like investing in Britain's energy infrastructure, things like getting NHS waiting lists down and getting 3 million people who are each off sick and off work well again, back on their feet and back to work. Those are all things that will help drive economic growth. But Rachel Reeves has been clear now as Shadow Chancellor, she wants to bring down the burden of taxation on working people. We've had to be careful about the promises we make in our manifesto. We make in our manifesto, we want people to know that these are promises we can keep and that the country can afford.

Of course, we'd like to go further, but we've been very disciplined in terms of what goes into this manifesto so that people know it's real change. It's change they can believe in. Because I know there are millions of people out there at the moment who are undecided about how to vote at this general election, who are deeply cynical about politics and politicians. What we're trying to do, as well as rebuilding our economy and rebuilding our public services, we are going to have to work very hard to rebuild trust in politics itself.

Okay, there will be a lot of economists that will argue with you saying that the tax burden under the Tories will be higher than under Labor. The figures I've got say that Labour's tax burden would be 37.4% compared to the Tories at 36.8%. But let's move on from that so we don't just talk about the tax burden, because I do want to talk about growth. Growth clearly critical to your plans. How much growth do you need there to be for you to be able to do what you say you want to do?

All of the promises that are in our manifesto are already fully costed and fully funded. What Rachel Reeve will not do is spend money based on jam tomorrow. It is hard, as Paul Johnson at the IFS acknowledged, it is hard to predict future growth. We've not backed on that in terms of our part.

How much do you need in order to carry out your plans? Because you say that economic growth is crucial to your plans.

As I said, Anna, in terms of the policies The promises we have costed for our manifesto, the promises we are making in this manifesto, they are all fully funded. Of course, if we get the economy growing, we will then have more money available to either put back in people's pockets or to invest in vital public services. But what Rachel Reeve will not do is to spend money that she doesn't have, that the country doesn't have. That's why we've been so disciplined in these choices. If, as we expect, we can get the economy growing again, if we can get growth motoring in our economy, then we We can have more available to invest in our public services or to put back into people's pockets, and that will give us the freedom and the flexibility to make those choices at that stage. But in terms of the pledges that are in our manifesto, they are already fully costed and fully funded.

Okay, I want to get your reaction to the latest hospital waiting list figures which came out yesterday. They've gone up again for the first time in seven months. What did you make of that?

In the blown a hole in Rishi Sunak's credibility He said he would cut waiting lists when he became Prime Minister. They are now higher than they were when he became Prime Minister. As we saw yesterday, they are rising. The only way we're going to get waiting lists down is if we have a Labor Government that can deliver We have over 40,000 more appointments every week. That's a fully funded pledge in our manifesto, double the number of scanners so that we can get the seven and a half million on the waiting list down. Also, as we're talking about today, an extra eight and a half thousand mental health workers to get more than a million people who are on mental health waiting lists, the treatment that they need and deserve as well. We've got a strong record on this. The last Labor government delivered the shortest waiting times and the highest patient satisfaction in the history of the NHS. We did it before and with the support of the voters on July the fourth, we can do it again. I urge people to give change a chance by voting for the NHS, voting for Labor on the fourth of July.

I know we're running out of time, but very quickly, I want to get your reaction to this one poll that has put reform ahead of the Tories for the first time. How do you feel about them potentially being your closest rivals?

Say two things. Firstly, the reform is very much part of the Conservatives' psychodrama. We've seen conservative candidates like Andrea Jenkins putting Nigel Farage positively on her leaflets instead of her own leader. We got to bear in mind, if we have another conservative government, that is the chaos and division we're going to be saddled with for another five years. The country can't afford that. In terms of labor versus reform, we're going to take them on. We're going to take them on in the battle of ideas and the battle of arguments. I just urge people to bear in mind about Nigel Farage. Look, he is a formidable campaigner. I don't doubt that. I don't underestimate him, but he has never, ever had to deliver the change that he always says he's calling for. He's never really been tested as a politician. He's never been elected to our parliament. I hope that voters in Clacton and voters across the country choose change with labor on July the fourth, because only labor can deliver the change our country is crying out for.

Okay, well, West Streeting, I know you're a busy man. You got to go.

We've got to let you go.Thanks very much.Thank you very much.Thank you very much.Thank you very much.Thank you very much. Thanks, Anna.