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From the most trusted journalists at Comedy Central, an actually live special report. The Daily Show presents Indecision 2024, the first presidential debate, again, now with 50% less, Old Man. Here's your host, Jon Stewart.

Hello, everybody. Hello. Yes, you're here. Welcome to The Daily Show. My name is Jon Stuart. The second presidential debate has just wrapped up. We are live. Well, technically, I guess this is the second presidential debate. The first presidential debate of this matchup. I can't wait to see who the winner will take on next, I think. We're coming to you live, ladies and gentlemen. The stakes couldn't be higher as we all try and figure out who will be the next president of of Paulinev Miazgank. It's an exciting night for citizens of that esteemed nation, as the rest of us watch with great interest from the neighboring country of no one gives a shitistan. By the way, if you have any friends in Paul and Nevev, me ask, can you see if they can do anything about congestion pricing? All right, forget it. But so far, it seems It's like this presidential race is going to be a tight one. The election, now a dead heat.

Separated by razor-thin margins.

Neck and neck.

Feels like a jump-all race right now.

For all intents and purposes, horses and handgranates, it's a coin flip.

The tightest race in a generation.

As tight as it can get.

As tight as a tick. As tight as a too tight bathing suit in a too long car ride home from the beach.

That seems very tight. It's as tight as a teenage boy's pants during a Sydney Sweeney film festival. It's It's tighter than Sydney Sweeney's scheduling windows, given how busy she is with projects and in demand as a producer to say nothing of the... Anyway, she's very talented. Of course, with an election this tight, it It is important to build out a more diverse coalition. And recently, Donald Trump has picked up the unexpected support of former Democrats, RFK Jr. And Tulsi Gabbard, and might even have picked up one of Jeffrey Epstein's most esteemed former lawyers.

I am no longer a Democrat. I am no longer a member of the Democratic Party. This was not my party. I just felt appalled when I watched the Democratic National Convention. I can't associate myself with the party itself.

No, wait. Don't go. Oh, you're no longer the Democratic Party, Alan Dershowitz? Well, guess what? Democrats don't want you anyway because the Democratic Party has standards, okay?

We don't need- Last week, former Vice President Dick Cheney endorsed Vice President Harris.

Would you excuse me? What's that?

I don't know what came over me. Anyway, going into the debate, one thing was... I'm sorry. You know what, Dick Cheney, can you meet me over by camera one?

Fuck off. Seriously. Fuck off.

You came this close to destroying the entire world. We were this close, closer than a teenage boy's pants. No, I'm not going to have any fun with this. And by the way, who in God's name is that endorsement going to sway? Well, I like the Democrats' policy on child tax credits, but are they bombing enough Middle Eastern countries? There's still some buildings standing. Someone should really do something. I'm fine. It's fine. Seriously, though, fuck that guy. Now, obviously... Oh, please. What an erudite takedown. Obviously, each candidate was going to have their goals and strategies. For Kamala Harris, it was going to be quite a needle to thread. She really wants to make sure that Americans know her back story, walk away understanding her policy stances, make sure she needles Donald Trump, gets him to lash out, expose the flaws that she sees in him, stays calm, be ready for all attacks. She got like two minutes. Is there anything else? There are some people who are worried that she might be overpreparing. Really? After doing all that, Trump was encouraged to take a simpler approach. They expect some goading remarks from Harris. They have stressed to him over and over again, Do not respond.

If you're going to respond at all to use facial expressions, not to actually go out there and say anything. Kamala say everything. Some say nothing. But here's what you do, Mr. Former President. If Kamala says something that surprises you, you just go... And if Kamala says something that makes you angry, you just go...

And if Kamala says something that makes you feel sexy time, you go, Oh, yeah.

Those were the goals. Both candidates have now entered the arena. Biden Biden and Trump did not greet each other, and Kamala... Oh, wait, she went for the handshake. Ladies and gentlemen, what an incredible display of the awkward tension that happens when your son is dating a biracial girl and you meet her parents for the first time. Do I?

.

..

As per tradition in American politics, the first question is always asked by the most handsome person in a 10-15-mile radius.

When it comes to the economy, do you believe Americans are better off than they were four years ago?

First, Yauza. Second. Answer the question, Ms. Vice President.

I imagine and have actually a plan to build what I call an opportunity economy. My plan is to give a $50,000 tax deduction to start up small businesses. I intend on extending a tax cut for those families of $6,000.

Holy shit. We're one question in and we're all millionaires. Oh, my God. Donald, your response to the question, Is the economy better now than it was four years ago?

We have millions of people pouring into our country from prisons and jails, from mental institutions and insane asylums. They're dangerous. They're at the highest level of criminality. They are taking over the towns. They're taking over buildings. They're going in violently.

Ladies and gentlemen, I just want to say, after surviving the PTSD of the last presidential debate, How unbelievably refreshing it is to go back to the same old, Nobody's going to answer any fucking questions. This is unbelievable. We're back. America is back. Yeah. You ask them a question, they just turn the tide and answer whatever they want to answer. Now that we're returning to the clichés, the standards of American political theater, I think it's only fair if someone would do the honors of the first baseless ad hominem.

She's a Marxist. Everybody knows she's a Marxist. Her father's a Marxist professor in economics, and he taught her well. But when you look at what she's done to our country...

Oh, shit. She's about to be like, Motherfucker, let's just do this. I'm going to... She's about to... A Marxist, she's about to open up a can of Ass Capotille on Donald Trump. Lindsay Davis, you better change the subject before the fingers on Kamala's hand unite. I want to turn to the issue of abortion. Oh, boy. I'm not superstitious, but this is where the wheels fell off for Biden. He was asked about abortion, and he somehow spun it into, Why are immigrants raping people? He ended with a classic phrase, We'll never forget, and that's when we finally beat Medicare. They're feeling it, too, ladies and gentlemen. As before, President Trump, you have the first crack at answering why you killed Roe v Wade.

We've gotten what everybody wanted, Democrats, Republicans, and everybody else, and every legal scholar wanted it to be brought back into the states, and the States are voting. I did something that nobody thought was possible.

John Stewart from the I was watching this live, Times-Pickean. What you just said, yeah, that's actually insanely false. The majority of people wanted it. You know what? Kamal Harris, can you address this with a bit more eloquence?

I have talked with women around our country. You want to talk about this is what people wanted? Pregnant women who want to carry a pregnancy to term suffering from a miscarriage, being denied care in an emergency room because the health care providers are afraid they might go to jail, and she's bleeding out in a car in the parking lot. She didn't want that. Holy shit.

She crashed that. This is like, what? This is like one of those Groundhog Day movies where you get to go back and fix the bad way that something happened earlier to the good way. Then you learn Italian in the piano, and then you get sad, and then despondent, and then you learn how to love yourself. Anyway, Trump will now finally have to answer to his abortion policy.

You know what it reminds me of when they said they're going to get student loans terminated, and it ended up being a total catastrophe.

You don't have an answer. Student loan smoke bomb. But we're settling into a rhythm here. Nice back and forth. I got to give it to Trump. He's sticking to his guns, and he's not letting Kamala Harris get under his skin. I actually think she's not going to be able to needle him.

I'm going to invite you to attend one of Donald Trump's rallies. He will talk about when mills cause cancer. What you will also notice is that people start leaving his rallies early out of exhaustion and boredom.

Oh, shit. He's just going to start taking off his ears and be like, That's it, motherfucker. Let's go. Folks, the eagle has landed. She has attacked what is Donald Trump's most cherished family member, his rally crowds. Donald, remember your training. The question is about why you killed the bipartisan immigration bill. You don't need to think about the up.

First, let me respond to the rallies. She said, People start leaving. People don't go to her rallies.

Son of a bitch.

People don't leave my rallies. We have the biggest rallies, the most incredible rallies in the history of politics. Our country is being lost. We're a failing nation. In Spring field, they're eating the dogs, the people that came in. They're eating the cats. They're eating the pets of the people that live there.

What the fuck just happened? I get these unbelievable reality people don't leave them. They're eating dogs. In Springfield, the immigrants are eating people's dogs. Which reminds me, if I may, for just a quick moment. A quick reminder to all the pet owners out there. Always remember to leash your dogs. It's an important way to keep your dogs from fighting other dogs or being hit by a car or being eaten by your immigrant neighbors. Oh, I'm sorry. Also, fuck off Dick Cheney. But I'm sorry. You were saying?

I just want to clarify here. You bring up Springfield, Ohio, and ABC News did reach out to the city manager there. He told us there had been no credible reports of specific claims of pets being harmed, injured, or abused by individuals within the immigrant community.

I've seen people on television. Let me just say here, this is the- The people on television said, My dog was taken and used for food. So maybe he said that, and maybe that's a good thing to say for a city manager.

I'm not taking this from television.

I'm taking it from the City Manager. But the people on television are saying their dog was eaten by the people that went there.

Again, the Springfield City Manager says there's no evidence of that.

Having spent some time in Springfield myself, I believe I know what's happening here.

I believe Trump himself may be becoming one of Springfield's most famous residents. I believe we have some footage. It's right in being old. No one listens to you.

Someone ate my dog.

Finally, no debate with the former President would be complete without addressing the former President's closing number of the Trump show's first term.

Mr. President, on January sixth, you told your supporters to march to the Capitol. You said you would be right there with them. Is there anything you regret about what you did on that day?

It It wasn't done by me. It was done by others. It would have never happened if Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington did their jobs. I wasn't responsible for security. Nancy Pelosi was responsible. She didn't do her job. I had nothing to do with that other than they asked me to I'm not going to make a speech. I showed up for a speech.

You spent two months riling up your base that our country had literally been stolen from them through fraudulent means, that you could never even get a whiff of in a court of law and let yourself just abuse them. You pressed on, you abused their trust. You showed up for a speech. You fucking tweeted, Join me on January 6. It will be wild. But suddenly now, I was just a hired magician to the bar mitzvah. I didn't do anything. I showed up with a hat and a rabbit, and then the whole party went out of control. This is it, ladies and gentlemen. I don't know if this debate is going to change anything. I really don't. People are awfully set in the manner that they view these proceedings. What I think is a home run answer for one candidate, someone else views as a dodge or a lie or any of those other things. In some ways, it doesn't matter what they say anymore. But one thing will always be true, and it is the quality of the former president I respect the least. Whenever he is cornered and forced to face even the smallest of consequences for his own mendacity and scheming, he reverts to the greatest refuge of scoundreals, as Shaggy would say, It wasn't me.

I did nothing wrong.

I just showed up. They're the ones who went crazy. This man who constantly professes to be your champion, who says they're going to have to go through him to get to you, will always, when the boat is going down, be the first into the lifeboats, because in that moment, he will always say the same thing. I didn't know anything about it. I was just told to show up for a cruise, even though everybody knows he was the fucking captain of the ship. In any other country, that lap In any other country, that lack of accountability would be disqualifying. But in this country, it means the race is tighter than Would you excuse me for just one second? We'll be right back after this. Steve Ballmer will be here. Thank you very much. Hey, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the show. I have a quick bit of breaking news. If you'll excuse me, I have some breaking news. I've just been handed this bullet, breaking news. We talked a little bit earlier about these debates. Do they even mean anything? Do they even do anything? Apparently, they did move the needle enough for one undecided voter, a Ms. Taylor Swift, has endorsed Kamala Harris.

That's what happened. You know what this means. Taylor Swift and I We're watching TV at the same program at the same time. My guest tonight... My guest tonight is the former CEO of Microsoft. He owns the Los Angeles Clippers and is the founder of USA Facts. Please welcome to the program, Mr. Steve Ballmer. Come on. All right, It's so nice to see you.

Good to be here.

Now, young man, advice. So a storied career. You're one of the first employees in Microsoft. You become a CEO of Microsoft. You own the Los Angeles Clippers. You have this dream life that as a kid, you probably never even thought those were the heights that you might be able to attain. And in that moment, you turn your attention to creating a fact website.

Exactly. Exactly. I retired from Microsoft, and I have nothing to do except to dive deep dark into government numbers. Seriously.

It feels like an anti midlife crisis. It feels like a man has decided, Well, I'm just going to give up.

Well, my wife got after me to start helping with the family philanthropy, and I kept saying, No, no, no, no. Government takes care of all those things. And they don't. And she said, You're coming with me. I snuck in the back and said, But I'm going to look up the numbers.

You did look up the numbers. What you've done is, and it's a phenomenal site, and I make jokes, but it is so necessary in this world to provide the data from reputable sources. How do you even... How do you decide what to put in there? How do you decide what are the sources? We have a guy here, Adam Chautekoff in Chod's We Trust. He is a researcher extraordinaire. He is the one who aligns us with, That's a partisan site. You might want to stay away from that. That's a thing. Is that how you operate it or is this an algorithm? How is this done?

No, we started with the concept that said, let's look at government in its totality. Because if you look at little pieces, I grab a number and I can make it sound large. I can make it sound small. So let's put things in context. Let's put them in context with history. Let's only use government numbers. We go to 100 different government databases, and then we said, What does government do? We turn to the prolog of the preamble to the Constitution. It lays out four missions. We took everything government spends money on. Boom. How much taxes are we raising and other money? How much are we spending? And what outcomes are we getting? Because government's not like a business.

That, to me, is the crucial aspect. When Democrats talk about we need to tax billionaires more, no offense, and when we need to do these things, I think the one place where it falls short is I don't think people feel that more money is necessarily the answer, but maybe efficacy. It's not like we don't spend money on antipoverty. The efficacy might not be there. Did you discover programs that seem to be really effective and other areas where that money seems to be squandered? What were some of the data points that you found that gave you a clear picture?

Let me start with 86% of all federal We can talk separate about state and local spending. But 86% of all federal spending is in a few simple areas.

Okay, let's go.

Number one, paying our debts. Got to pay the interest on our debt.

How much goes to the debt? I've seen breakdown of taxes. I've heard that the third largest or second largest portion of our tax money goes to pay down the interest on the debt.

It's creeping up there. It's number five right now. We go with Social Security is number one. Medicare, number two.

Okay. So two things that we pay into but don't get till we're older. Correct. Okay. What's number three?

Number three is the military.

Okay.

Medicaid. Is four? Medicaid is four. Exactly right. Sorry. The debt is four. Oh. Medicaid is five. Okay. Veterans benefits. Okay. Let me see if I forgot anything.

You know what, though? Let's stop right there because I think- Stop right there because there's no inefficiency so far. I would disagree with you. Okay, go ahead. If I'm thinking about this country, and I'm looking out into the audience, and I'm saying, So what is the tension in their lives? I don't necessarily know that because we've only worked together as an audience once before. But I would say it's the squeeze. There's people that had some college debt, but now they're in their 40s or 50s. Just as they're clearing out all those things and getting into a decent earning place, their kids are getting ready to go to college, and the costs of that have exploded. Just as that's happening, their parents, who they thought were going to be fine with their Social Security and their Medicare and all those other things, are now needing real elder care and assisted living care. Now, all the equity that they have built up over that time is now dissipating between those two groups. So child care, health care, elder care, all those things. The first six tranches of where our tax money goes doesn't seem like it's spent efficiently on relieving that pressure on For families.

Now, that might be the wrong way to look at it.

Let me push back. Please. Let me push back. I give you... Well, not you. You can give me. I'm 68. You give me a Social Security check.

I take money from you.

You take money from me. That's just my premise. Okay, fine. Probably a good one. It's probably a good premise. Your premise is fine, too. It's probably a good premise. All right. Anyway, a family gets a Social Security check. Right. That's going to help that senior who may need care, may need this, may need that, may need something else.

But designed mostly by the government because they thought we would all be dead by '65. We've all out... We've lived much longer than the government thought we would.

The promise, yeah. The promise of FDR days, we've outlived it. Nobody's quite sure what to do about it. We do know that people are doing less of their own elder care, more of that's getting paid for by the government in the market through third parties.

You do see a lot of people who their elder care is paid for by whatever equity they had left, so they can't leave anything to their kids. They mortgage their house or they go through those things where they convert it into liquidity and they use that money, hopefully, and it's there till they pass.

It's a little bit of whack-a-mole, though. Yes. We can increase taxes, we can borrow more money, or we can live with the spending profile we have today. Something gives in that equation. Me, personally, I will confess, non-partisan view for USA Facts. We just give you the data, you make up your own mind. I'm a businessman. Balancing the budget seems good to me. So I look at it and it's simple. We probably need some more taxes, probably. We probably need less spending, probably.

Less spending or more efficient spending? Is it a question of are we using, for instance... So Mark Cuban was on, and you guys, I'm sure, go to the Billionaire's Brunch, which, by the way, I never understood, why did they do that at Waffle House? It feels like You could get a better... Well, forget it.

It's Billionaire's Basketball Lunch in that case. Go ahead.

Billionaires basketball lunch. He finds out that these pharmaceutical benefit managers are jacking up and hiking all these pharmaceutical prices. The government is not really allowed to negotiate with them, so he creates this business in which he does that. Is too much of our money that we spend on poverty programs or elder programs going through these middlemen that are enriching themselves, even the ACA, right? You think about Obamacare, what it really is, is a boon for insurance companies to jump into another marketplace where the government says, Well, we'll keep this same inefficient system where you get to deny care when you want to, and the pricing isn't transparent, and it's not really a free market system because health care isn't a free market system. We're just going to subsidize that insurance policy. It doesn't really change the dynamic of how health care is given. Isn't that inefficient?

Yes, and-Son of a bitch. Yeah, son of a bitch. You put it in a little bit of context. It's inefficient. But if I tell you it's less than 1% of total health care spending in the US, less than 1%, you can say it's inefficient. I won't disagree with you. I can say it's 1%. Even if we crushed the issue you're talking about down to nothing, down to absolute nothing, we still have a problem with health care spending. We still are the need to deliver health care.

But isn't some of the problem we have with health care spending because the largest tranche of customers are unable to really negotiate effectively because it's not... We have a for-profit health care system when You can't comparison shop for heart attack doctors. You basically get driven to wherever is closest.

There are three people basically who insure almost everybody. 92% of Americans are not sure. That's a problem. But let's just talk about who are the three are. Medicare, Medicare, where they can negotiate some things, but not others. For example, prescription benefits, except for the new caveats. Medicaid, where government negotiates really hard, really hard. I'm really impressed by what the government negotiates on behalf of the Medicaid patient. Then for private insurance companies, and they're grinders, baby. They're delivering health care $6,000 a person. Now, they're younger. Medicaid, the most vulnerable people in our population. $10,000 a person, harder to take care of, and then senior $16,000 a year in Medicare.

Who do you think is most satisfied with their care in those three tranches?

Private insurance. No question.

Private insurance over- Again, I don't have data from the US government, but I'm going to guess private insurance.

Right.

Is there any quam in your mind of... They say that the biggest reason people go bankrupt is medical bankruptcy. Is there any reason in your mind that a country like ours, with the wealth that we have, should ever have a situation where people who are sick, so they might be more satisfied. But is it at the cost of the percentage of them that will go bankrupt because there's no government backstop on it?

Well, do I think Is that a good thing? No. I don't think anybody should go bankrupt for their health. I don't. Now, how do we get from where we are to there is important. It is important. I have no prescription for that. But me personally and emotionally, I agree with you a thousand %. But to solve that problem, what other changes are we going to make? What are the things that we're going to give up? What are the things that we're going to get? It seems like a much smaller fix to fix that problem than to try to reinvent the healthcare system again. We have problems in our healthcare system, but the inefficiency, I think right now, tends to be... If you just compare us to Europe, we do about twice as many procedures as they do in Europe. Our medical professionals get paid about twice as much as European medical professionals.

So doesn't that sound like it's a system incentivized to that?

It is. And it is. Absolutely. Except Medicaid.

Right. So they don't do twice as many.

Except Medicaid, because Medicaid is essentially it's on an HMO model, and things get negotiated differently.

Do you think that a public option, the one that everybody shouts is the death of it all, is the thing that blows up the system? Because in some I always look at it like, what do I think government's purpose is? I love the fact that we're a checks and balances system. It seems like within the government there is, okay, judicial, congressional executive, and they're all pushing and pulling They weren't expecting the partisan battles that we get, but we got them. But it does seem like corporate power, transnational, multinational corporate power also needs a check and a balance because capitalism is at its heart, It's destructive. It generates wealth, but it's destructive. Why do we fight so hard against the government being a proper check on that against that exploitation, whether it be in the medical field or in the college education field or any of those other things? It seems like in European countries, I'm not saying it's a panacea, they pay more money, but they seem to get the services that connect more directly with their lives back to the earlier conversation that we were having. I think if you read these tranches out to a European social Democrat, whatever, they would think, Well, that's crazy.

You haven't gotten anything. You haven't gotten any childcare. You haven't gotten any of the things. You haven't gotten free education. Why is it that we have so much trouble? We generate so much wealth. Why do we distribute it so inefficiently, it would seem?

Well, let me give a perspective. Please. I think the Twin Towers of America are democracy and capitalism. Okay. I really believe that wholeheartedly.

I don't want to tell you how that story ends, but go ahead.

Good point. You're You're killing me here. You're killing me here.

It's tomorrow, for fuck's sake. Jesus. What are you doing in here? All right. I'm in New York.

I walked right into it. I'm sorry. I apologize.

What do you think I'm doing all day tomorrow? All right, go ahead. Capitalism and democracy.

There are two pillars. I'm going to go back to pillars. Yes, pillars. Thank you.

Thank you. Much better.

Capitalism is the predictable one, actually.

Really? That's interesting.

You give capitalism a set of rules. People are going to compete. They're going to try to make as much money as they can, and that's what's going to happen. It's predictable.

But you don't think it's, by its nature, exploitative, though? Like the monopolies, the rigging of the system.

That seems all built into it. I'm going to get to the second part. I'm sorry. Democracy.

The fact that capitalism is predictable is actually a great tool for government. Government needs to then train this highly predictable tool to do what society wants it to do.

That's the role of democracy is to... It is a role of democracy, is to inform where you want to point this highly predictable capitalist motive. Look, if the world needs more regulations, put them in. But you're going to get- I don't know if it's more regulation, but it certainly needs to be something that helps protect us against capitalism's baser instinct.

In some respect. Just let me give a base instinct.

Okay. Let's say my base instinct is to...

I want to destroy the habitat of a set of birds by building a windmill.

Okay, let's say that's the topic. Can I just say something very quickly? Yeah. You bastard. Why? You son of a bitch. Okay, Mr. Democracy, let's take it on. The birds? Yes. The capitalist is going to try to get that windmill built.

Sure. If you want it built, capitalist will get it built. If you want to protect the birds, the capitalist will stop trying to build that windmill. I talked to a guy who's actually trying to build one of the largest wind farms in the world. I'm going to give you a different example. Give me a different example. Capitalists want to find the cheapest labor they can possibly find. So they offshore all the jobs in manufacturing and all these other things to Vietnam and Bangladesh and India and China and places where worker protections don't exist, undercutting American workers. And the democratic system fails its own on workers and not only allows it, encourages it, and then decides, Well, you're doing so well on labor costs. Why don't we cut your taxes as well?

In my mind, I view it as the pendulum has swung completely, and we are at the mercy of those instincts. And democracy is failing in whatever its directive is. It doesn't sound to me like democracy points capitalism. It sounds to me like capitalism points democracy. I'll speak that. I I'll speak now as a former CEO. Capitalism responds. People are generally good people. They'll respond to, You give us an incentive, we'll go do it.

You give us a regulation, we're going to obey it.

No, it's what happens. It really is all right to the 99%, jeez, you won't want to get anywhere here. I give you 2008. But no, I understand. So all I'm What you're saying is, let's take your labor cost issue. Perfectly good issue. Yes, businesses are going to try to reduce labor costs. If you don't want those jobs to move, then government needs to put a tax or an incentive, they're kissing cousins, if you will, to keep the jobs on shore and take the consequences, though.

But then we're competing for their love. What about this? They get the benefit of our stability, of our capital, of all the things that make us a free market, stable democracy, and they have no responsibility. They get all of the infrastructure and none of the toll. That's the part that I don't understand. We have States competing with each other for who can fuck over workers the best. When everybody talks about globalization and Mexico and India are stealing our jobs, well, South Carolina is stealing them from New York.

They're all competing to see who can give the sweetest deal. That feels like where the balance is off, where the pendulum has to swing. I personally have no problem with government providing more direction to capitalism. I don't. But then there sometimes are untoward consequences. Let's just take the offshoring. Sure. Okay, let's just say whatever the policy is, it gets more jobs on short at higher wages. Prices will Prices will go up. As long as that trade-off is the trade-off that people want, less buying power, but more people have higher paying jobs, how that actually shakes out for the American...

I'm not an economist. I'm not going to make predictions, but there is a trade-off on most of these decisions. Is there a possibility, though, that there's a renegotiation of what normal is in terms of profit margin and in terms of capitalization and in terms of corporatization and in terms of taxation? Is there a new normal that can be achieved? We saw it in the pandemic where, of course, there were supply chain crunches and that drove up prices. But there's no question that a lot of companies took advantage of a difficult moment to set a new bar of expectation for people.

Now that the supply chain has eased, that expectation still exists. Since the start of the pandemic, CPI, price index is up about 19%. Right. Okay. We still have inflation. Those prices are not going to come back down. They're just going to grow more slowly. Wages were up 21%. Wages were actually up more than prices. If you take a look at it, the buying power, it's not much, but the buying power of Americans increased slightly. Nobody likes inflation. It's too disorienting, et cetera. But it wasn't a net negative trade.

It feels bad. People feel bad. I know that. Do you think, though, that as complex as inflation is and all the different avenues that go into it, do you think a portion of it, at least, because I listened to some of those earnings calls in the pandemic and people were like, We're killing it.

Our profits have never been higher. Everybody's like, Yay. Isn't that a part of it? Then I would say, if I was to make a suggestion, go increase corporate income taxes. Just increase corporate income taxes.

That reduces profit.

I just don't know. I just don't know if it's politically viable. Regulating individual decisions, this is just my point of view, bad.

You want to take my profits as a company? Do you think there is a transaction to be had between government and corporate leaders where they come to an understanding that it's a more symbiotic relationship and not an exploitative relationship.

The invisible hand, so to speak, of Adam Smith.

Yes. There is no master planning. You can't say be nice.

But we're not free. There is, though. There's subsidies that they get. There is no free. There's subsidies and there's regulations. There are rules, and I love that. I love... Look, there's some regulations. If I'm running a company, am I like or not like?

We just built an arena for our basketball team. Why? We had to have our own home. I was just kidding. So we can beat the Knicks when they come to town. Let me just explain very quickly. No, it makes sense. Listen, man, it's an incredibly complex conversation, and I really do appreciate your patience with me on it and all that. It's just I think the frustrations have been with. What I love about your site, and let's bring it back to that, is that you've brought together all the data and context necessary to have these conversations, because these conversations feel like they don't occur. All that occurs on the news is, how do you think that's going to play in Wisconsin?

Nobody seems to want to get into the weeds on what you're talking about. Well, that's what we're trying to do. We have very conscious, non-partisan. Here's the data we're I'm not going to make it digestible for you. We're not going to try to tell funny stories. We're not going to make forecasts about the future. There's a quote that's very motivating to me as we started this thing from James Madison. So you go all the way back to the founding the country. No, go ahead. No, I'm just kidding. He said something like, A popular government without popular information or the means of acquiring it is a prolog to a farce or a tragedy, or perhaps both.

As I sit here and I observe lots in American politics. I believe that. Our site is trying to combat that by making popular information available to our populace. We make videos. Who's the star of the videos? Steve Ballmer. I'm just going to say something real quick. Not for nothing. You live in Los Angeles. You couldn't grab Hanks. Come on. You know what I'm talking about? Throw him out there to give some facts. It's a fabulous site, and you're doing great work there. I so appreciate you coming on and giving us such interesting perspective on business and government and regulation and all those different things. It's really helpful. So thank you for doing that. Check out USAFacts. Org, Mr. Steve Banner. And you're not going to beat our next. We'll be right back after this. Let me tell you something. Are you guys going to be... Hey, everybody. That is our show for tonight. Stay tuned tomorrow night. Jordan Klepper returns for the rest of the week.

Here it is. Your moment is If we can come up with a plan that's going to cost our people, our population, less money and be better health care than Obamacare, then I would absolutely do it.

But until then, I'd run it as good as it can be run.

So just a yes or no, you still do not have a plan. I have concepts of a plan. Explore more shows from The Daily Show podcast universe by searching The Daily Show, wherever you get your podcasts. Watch The Daily Show weeknights at 11:00, 10:00 Central Comedy Central, and stream full episodes anytime on Paramount Plus.

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