Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the car rental studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show where debt is dumb. Cash is king in the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host, Anthony Neal, Remzi personality number one, best selling author of the book Debt Free Degree is my co-host today. Open phones at eight eight two five five two two five.

As we talk about your life and your money, triple eight eight two five five two two five.

Brandon is with us in Denver to start off this hour. Hi, Brandon. How are you? I'm wonderful. So how are you today? Better than I deserve. How can we help you first? I am a one third owner of an LLC that owns three rental properties within the LLC is owned by myself, one by my brother, one third by my parents. We all kind of got into business together about seven years ago. We would like to dissolve the LLC because we're all kind of at different points of our life and would like to be able to go do different things.

Everything is good relationally and we're trying to figure out the best way to do that without a really dramatic capital gains tax hit or if there's any way to do that, we can you we all purchased into the LLC for about two hundred and ten thousand each and bought rental property. There was about six hundred and thirty thousand dollars in value. It's now grown to about a million ninety five, which would need each of our current stake in the 80s, about three sixty five.

We want to know, can we divvy up the LLC based on the property values of when we bought them so that we can then each pay the capital gains tax later if we ever were to sell the properties? Or do we have to do that now as a current market value?

You don't have to get with a tax professional. I probably would go so far as to recommend a tax attorney to help you through this.

So your game plan it do all three properties have similar equities and so you're just going to each take a property?

Unfortunately, no one. One is two of them are very similar. They're both fourplex units that are currently very, very similar. One is a single townhome. The two for Plexus are probably worth about four hundred and twenty to four hundred and fifty thousand each. Not counting on not counting the capital gains.

Does anyone necessarily want to really have a huge desire to keep any of these properties?

We all would love to keep the property because the real estate end is something all three of us would like to do long term. We're just looking to dissolve the partnership, to keep good relationships and to make sure that we don't ever run into an area where we're trying to.

OK, so if if you're unequal, one of you is going to give the another one some money and the property which which would work actually the best the way it is, my my brother would like to take the smaller of the properties and then be able for us to to pay him for the difference of what the value would be. And so what which is no problem. We have my wife and I have the money to do that. My parents have the money to do that.

We would have no problem.

I'll tell you how I think you can do it, but you're going to have to go to somebody that's about two notches smarter than me to be sure.

OK, there's a thing called a ten thirty one tax deferred exchange, and that is how we used to trade properties in the old days. You know, you'd pick out a property that you wanted. I had a property and we would trade the properties in the capital gains are the gains moved one property, the other. And there was no activation of the gain. No taxes, OK? Yes, sir. Now they've advanced that are OK to where you can sell a property into a special escrow account for a ten thirty one tax deferred exchange.

And then you have a certain number of days, I believe it's like sixty days or something like that to select the next property and roll your equity into that.

And when you do it is it is considered a trade and so there is no taxes, the capital gains that your basis moves from your old property into the new property. So eventually, someday somebody's going to get to tax it.

But for now, you've moved your equity and your taxable gains over into the other property.

So what I'm thinking here is that you guys might be able to flip this whole thing into that escrow account and use that escrow account to pass out. Each of you getting one of the three. In other words, you guys sell it into the escrow account and then each of you buy the property that you want out of that escrow account under a ten thirty one tax deferred exchange umbrella that might work. That that was our hope.

Initially, we actually have been to. At least one account so far that's told us that's not an option, because since the properties are owned by the LLC, that the LLC would have to, then, yeah, buy the properties that you can't that you wouldn't be able to transfer them to individual ownership. Yeah, that's true.

That's right. OK, so much for my theory. You know, I think I think you got to think you got better advice from him than you did me. OK, crap.

I'm just trying to keep you from giving the government money for you and me both, brother. You and me both.

Let me think. Let me tell you, I think I think the other thing you can do is that.

You guys are going to have to trade some money with each other, but if one of you kept them all the shares in the LLC, that one is going to have no gain.

Right. The other two are going to have gains when you move it out.

And the one that keeps the shares in the LLC doesn't have any gains going to have to morally want to have to help pay the taxes to the other to create when you move them out, which is which is absolutely an option that we looked at, kind of just making sure with that both morally and legally, if we were to do that and then that person who is not taking the capital gains, it would it be both moral and legal to exchange funds to the people that are taking the capital gains it under the gift, under the gift of tax law or whatever.

That person then have to say, OK, you could do it under a gift tax law.

And if it's in excess of the next year's gift tax limit, which I don't remember, it is probably 14000 or so. It's indexed. It changes every year. And if it's in excess of that, unless you guys have estates over 20 million dollars each, you can do a unified estate tax credit and avoid the gift tax and you can move any amount.

Well, I didn't think about going that route, OK? Yeah, my parents would be over the 20000, but they would probably be the one that would keep the share of the losses to me if we did the 20 million excuse me. They have a net worth over there, but they would probably use that. OK. There's a way to do that.

Wow. And, you know, I.

This is a great this is a great riddle. I love it, it's a wonderful riddle to work through because but there's there is a way to do it and screw the government. I promise you there is.

And I'm going to find it on a mission. I'm going to keep on this because there's a way to do it that is legal and moral under the current tax law. You've just got to think it through. And so far, two of the ideas didn't work. But yeah, you can move some money around.

I can give anybody money. I just if I give them more than the gift tax indexed amount, which I can't remember what that is this year, but I've got a cheat sheet here somewhere.

I found out. Oh, well, oh, wow. Oh, no, it's 15000, 15000 right now and it's going to go up, so. OK, so you can move 15000, but you're your Capricorns is going to be more fitting today on these things because you're you've gone from you've doubled. You've gone to 600000 and 200000 each of the 300. 200. Yeah. All your capital.

You're probably going to be 30 grand apiece on these things. It's not bad. I have depending on if you if you depreciated them down pretty heavy, maybe it might be more than that. It might be 40000, but you can get pretty close to the 15. You can do 15 one year, 15 another year, not even get in the unified estate tax credit. Maybe there's a way to do this. It's just a barrel of fishhooks that you've got, like a musky rope gets tangled up, shouldn't take an hour to untangle it.

But, you know, that's what you got here. Fun. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Yes, folks, mortgage rates are really low, and while that's great news, watch out for mortgage lenders with a slick pitch claiming they have the lowest rates. Those deals often come with bad advice and hidden fees instead. I want you to call Churchill Mortgage to buy a new home or refinance because they think, like I do call today, triple A loan, 200 or Churchill Mortgage Dotcom.

This is a paid advertisement in MLS Idy one five nine one in MLS Consumer Access. Doug Equal Housing Lender 1749 Mallory Lane Sweet 100. Brentwood, Tennessee three seven zero two seven.

Anthony O'Neal Ramsey personality is my co-host today, open phones, a triple eight eight two five five two two five. Allena is with us in Cleveland, Ohio. Hi, Alina. How are you?

Hi, Dave. I'm good. How are you?

Better than I deserve. What's up? So I just had a quick question. I'm making my bet Snowball. And I'm currently I have a list right now for everything besides student loans and collections. Now, I'm currently still in school. Do I pay off the student loans or do I go toward the collection of student loans are in deferment right now. How much longer do you have in school, Elena? If I continue two more years, if I stop and finish, I pay everything off, would be I would take a break for a year.

OK, are you cash flowing to the rest of your college experience right now? You know, that's why I was planning on stopping to bring it back to Cash-Flow. OK. All right.

So there's a difference in paying everything off while you're taking time off to pay everything off or taking time off because you can't cash flow it.

Yeah, which is it? I'm taking time off because I can't cancel it and don't want to get more in that no longer. OK.

And during that time you're going to pile up money to go back to school first or you're going to get out of debt first. It will be paying off my debt and then start saving for school. Gotcha.

OK, because if you quit school, you're going to activate these student loans, right?

Right. All right, how much debt do you have total again? Total of about twenty eight, mm hmm. How old are you? Twenty three. What are you studying? Yeah. Finances and how much of the 28 is student loan? Only 11. And what is it how much is in collections? About seven. OK. What's that from? Oh, credit and a called cash advance loans and how long has it been since you paid on those that are in collections?

The majority of them are like a little over a year. OK, and what is the other ten thousand dollars? Personal loans. My lease, my credit card, that's active at the moment, and that is the year lease. Yeah, if you mean your lease. The least. What do you that? And we still can't know. OK, what do you own your car, what's it take to pay the car off?

About a little less than four thousand, just about 4:00. So you're almost at the end of it? Yes.

Are you working right now? I am making yeah. Yeardley is about 30 for. OK. Hmm. What do you do, what do you do? I mean, I am in training to be an accountant. OK. OK, so the student loans, you're not paying anything on those collections. You're not hardly paying anything on it.

No. So it's almost as if you're out of debt now. In terms of what your monthly exposure is, so why can't you, Cash-Flow school, if you don't pay on the student loans and you don't pay on collections right now? Right. Because that's the majority of your best, think about how much I like, how much does it cost to go to school? A semester about. It's about 3000. Give or take. OK. Yeah, three K.

So you're looking at. I mean, well, actually, you still can do that. You still can do that. What's your monthly payment on this lease? Three fifty and it's going to be over in just a few months, right? Correct. Now, what are you going to do at the end of that for a car? I actually have a car that I did a stupid decision at least, but I go back to my regular car police and it's paid for.

And it's paid for. Yes. OK, yeah, so we get the court, we get the lease paid off, we leave the collections and collections don't pay interest, you don't pay on the student loans and you cash flow college.

And here's the other thing. And you don't have to quit. Yeah. And you cut up these credit cards because you're just digging yourself into a deeper hole. That's a good catch. All right. So because we're talking about these credit card, you say you still have currently open. So you need to stop borrowing money right now.

Yes, I'm the one getting paid off next month, actually, and it's getting close out as it is a cut up.

I'm sure you should. You just said it was active, you could be honest with. Well, it's open, as I said, but not I don't swipe it.

I think you did cut the card in half, literally. I sure did.

OK, I'm proud of you. Yeah. Yeah. All right. That's a good sign. All right. Here's what I want. You do. I want you to get in Ramsey plus. Yes, sir. We're going to pay for it for you. And that includes financial peace university, the every dollar premium map, everything you need to get through this. There's no reason for you to quit school. I want you to keep going. Yeah, but you're going to take an extra job and you're going to have about one more year.

You're going to be real tired this year. Yeah, but you're going to work all the time and go to school all the time.

But here's what's going to happen at the end of that year. You're going to have no current credit card debt. You're going to have no card debt and you're going to have gotten rid of the personal loan. So the only debt that you have, you're not making payments on. And then you'll be able to cash flow school original. Does that make sense? It does, and I think you can stay in school and do every bit of this, but you're going to be working a lot.

Yeah, that's six thousand dollars a year. You can do that, Alina. And honestly, maybe even consider looking at Uber now, since you're Aulani, you already have two years into it. Maybe even consider going online, doing some tutoring so you can make up your own hours so it doesn't get in the way of your education process. But you can get the six thousand dollars just from doing a side gig.

You can deliver pizzas and get that. Yeah. And so knock this stuff out, get that car gone, get that credit card, the active credit cards gon leave. The stuff that's in collections and collections of student loans are still stagnant while you're in school. So you're not having a cash flow there. Then all we got to come up with is three grand a semester and you can get that. Yeah. And so but you're going to have to be on a real detailed plan and it's like an obsession for you.

Yeah. That I'm going to school with adding no more debt.

And then when you come out of school, you can address that remaining 18000 very, very quickly. And you will know how to do it, because I'm going to teach you how Anthony's going to teach you how in Financial Peace University with Ramsey.

Plus, I'm going to give you a one year membership and you go through every detail of that and you do everything I say to do. And if you do that, you're going to come out and be going, touchdown, yes. You're going to be going a want and don't go make up your own plan. Hours works. Yeah. All right. So hold on, Kelly. I'll pick up and we're going to get you signed up as a gift.

And I don't want you to quit school. I want you to finish. Yeah, I'm proud of you. You're a neat young lady.

And you and some people probably ask himself, well, how come Dave didn't tell her to stop and pay off her debt because she's already halfway there?

That's three grand. Yes. Yeah. She's not going to an expensive school. No. If she told me she was going to spend fifty thousand dollars a year, she's quitting. Right. Because there's no way she's cash flow in that. Right. This is within reach. Yes. And the student loans can sit there. That's what they're designed to do for a student. Absolutely. And the collections that can sit there to. Absolutely.

And the longer they sit there, the more pliable they'll get laid down the only only on a day review. So but at the same time, no. Six thousand dollars a year. That's less than the average wage. Less, you know, that's average is ten thousand dollars a year. Yeah. So she's in a good position to go on ahead and cash flow that then her. Oh yeah.

Kelly never ever has debt free degree book to. Absolutely. To go with Ramsey plus package. Oh my gosh. I think that's it. Yeah. Yeah.

You think about giving away your book were you. Go ahead and give her the story. Student loan desk. She can already read that as well. So just give give her everything. Give everything.

So give. I'm sorry Kelly. Kelly's looking to see what's going on so give her Ramsey plus debt free degree.

Galley's about it comes out but I'm with the so I'm good.

That's nothing new about that open phone a triple eight to five five two two five.

Here's the thing. How do you eat an elephant a bite at a time with a freaking plan. Yes. You don't randomly run up and take a chunk out of it. That's good. You've got a plan and you execute step by step by step through that plan and it will take you into your future. And then when somebody asked, you can say, I'm living the dream. So this is the Dave Ramsey Show. Listen, there are some basic things that you should be doing to take care of your family, a roof over their head, food to eat, a car to get you from A to B and term life insurance, term life insurance is an immediate need no matter where you are in the baby steps, since your family is at no greater risk than when you're in debt.

The only place I send you for this is to Zander Insurance. They shop all the top insurance companies and they're committed to serving you. That's why I use them and have recommended them for over 20 years. Go to Zanda Dotcom are called 803, five, six, 42, 82. Happy Veterans Day to all of those of you that are serving and have served on the debt free stage, we continue that in the appropriate fatigues.

They're here. And Larry and Melissa are with us from Phoenix right here on the debt free stage in Nashville.

Hi, guys. Welcome. Hi. Hello. So you're obviously military that or you went to a supply store. A surplus store, right?

I think we have a surplus store.

You got your own at home. I've been serving a while. Have you? OK, what are you guys doing?

The military I saw on public health and I'm a military police officer. Public health.

Public health must be really exciting right now in the military. Yes, sir. Perfect time to serve.

Wow. Yeah. Wow. Amazing. How long have you guys been in?

18 years. I bet at 17 years. OK. Did you meet there at the military training class? Wow. Very cool. Very cool.

And both of you made a career out of it. Thank you for your service. Yes. Absolutely incredible. All right.

How much debt on your paid off? We paid off one hundred thirty five thousand. Very cool. How long will this take? Two years. Nine months. Very good.

And your range of income during that time? About 137 to 147.

Very cool. Good. Very neat. What kind of debt was the one? 35.

So it was all consumer, just credit cards and car loans. Just that simple. Yes, sir. Wow. Wow. I some nice cars. Yes. Yes, sir.

That are you just went hog wild on a credit card with a lot of vacations. Wow. Yes. OK. Did you sell any of the cars. You just paid them off.

So we traded in both OK. And got different cars so we could get quick, you know, move quicker through baby step two.

Yeah. Got cheaper stuff. Cheaper stuff. Yes. OK, so what did you sell and what did you trade for.

So I sold a GMC Acadia Denali down to a Honda Civic which I love.

Honda Accord fit in the back of it, Ali. Wow. Yeah.

And then I traded a Cadillac CTS coupe for a Ford Escape. And it was the same day. Dave. Oh, that one.

Hertz is not easy. Oh, that hurts. Yes. You guys wanted out of that fact. We did past. We did. That's impressive.

Now, people had to be giving you a hard time. Yes. Yes. They said we were crazy.

You go from Denali and CTS to escape and Civic. Oh, my God. The driveway is the driveway cringe.

That is awesome. Yes, sir. That had to be that was really all joking aside, emotionally painful days.

Oh, yeah. I think more so for him.

Yeah, I'm a car guy. It's a car younger. I've drove a sports car. So go into the escape. Was a little rough for me.

Yeah. That's RCTs is a beast. A lot of great car. Yes. Oh man. How many weeks later was it that you just said, God, I'm so smart. Well, for me, I don't know that I'm still wondering. I was going I was going with the flow. Oh, no. Oh, no.

OK, you got outranked or something. I don't know what happens to you. All right.

Very cool. OK, so. Well, the good news is, is that you've lived like no one else. Now you can live and drive like no one else. You will pay cash and drive whatever you want. So very, very cool.

So what started this intense journey? Because you did a really hard things on those cars.

So we came home to water leaking through the floorboards that we had just charged 14000 dollars to install. Oh, no. And we thought we were safe with our home warranty that we had purchased with this with the, you know, selling it with the buying of our home. And unfortunately, that that didn't pan out for us. So we made a lot of tearful phone calls to plumbers, but we didn't have any money. The home warranty wouldn't cover us.

We had no money and savings and all of our credit cards were maxed out. So the water was turned off and we had three kids in the house.

So we were pushed pretty far to our limit and a plumber out of the kindness of his heart or desperation in my voice. I'm not sure which one actually ended up coming out that night. And I ended up being a small feat. It was only 75 dollars to fix the actual problem. But unfortunately, we went to bed with a feeling of dread that night. Wow. So we went out the next day, the library and found the total money makeover and read it out loud that weekend to each other, cried a lot, fought a lot and started started baby step one, the next pay cycle.

Wow.

That is that's an intense process. Yeah. Yeah. Ouch. How long you been married? We just celebrated ten years in July. Wow. How old are your kids.

So Phoenix is 17 and then we have Noah who's six and Lily is four. Awesome.

Very cool. Yes. Very cool. Wow. That a, you know, when you have something that dramatic that just hit you in the face, you got to face it, then you can't you can't just walk away from that. I mean, it's two in your face, right? Right. So you had to do it, both of you.

And so that's that gives you enough emotional energy to run through the seat next to the Ford Focus move, which takes some emotional energy to do that. Right. Are the Denali to the Civic? Either one. But wow.

Wow, I, I can't thank you for serving. I grew up as a military child and some things probably have changed. So tell me. But one of the things I see coming from back when I was living on at Fayetteville at Fort Bragg, I would see these young young guys get the their signing bonuses, get their first check and run to the car dealership and buy the big nice brand new cars to that young person listening to today. What would you tell them that you wish you knew when you first started in the military, but all the great benefits that you receive.

So for me, I work with probably like 30 young men and women that are around in their younger 20s. Yeah. Teens, some of them. And I explain to them to do not go out and get a car that you can't afford, you know, save your money. Many of them have the money to buy a car and cash, but at the flashy thing that they keep in the parking lot is what they want. And I think that's, you know, like a show stopper.

But if they save their money and they do right by their money, they can actually drive whatever they want. And that's where I to learn myself. And I'm able to talk to them about that because I've had to walk that line myself. And hopefully for those out there, they do it the right way and they save the money and buy a nice car in cash.

Yeah, yeah. We've got a lot of chaplains teaching Financial Peace University all over the world through the military. And I've gotten the opportunity to be on several installations, several bases around and especially in America.

It amazes me that when you leave the gates, there is stupid for two miles on both sides of the road, like every dumb thing a 22 year old can do on the planet, stupid human tricks, stupid financial tricks, whatever they are, they're on both sides of the road for two miles outside of every base. It's like the worst of the worst.

And it's man, I'll tell you, you guys that are officers and senior and senior people have a real job, you know, just corralling some 22 year olds that are 21 year olds left home for the first time and keeping them out of that.

That's a deal, man. It's a real deal.

I think we focus on small goals for them. When we try to share our story, we try not to say, hey, pay off all your debt and sell everything and don't eat out for three years because that people like, whoa, no, thank you. Yeah, we try to sell it to them, you know, in small doses. And one that's really effective is showing them the calculator, you know, so if you invest Okano, it'll grow to this much in 10, 20, 30 years.

That's a five million dollar car you drive and hope you like it. Exactly. And then the twenty seven dollars a day is ten thousand dollars a year. That seems to be really effective.

Tummo as well. That's good. I like it. Small doses for me.

Yeah. Very cool. Well thank you again. Thank you for your service. Thank you for your incredible story because you guys went all in. I mean you there's no question you've completely changed the way your brain works about money. I mean, you blew up everything.

That's it's very impressive. It is strenuous. That much emotional shift in two years and nine months is strenuous. It really is.

It adds a stress level to your life to just have that much transformation going on, even though it's positive, you know.

So very, very, very well done. So very proud of you guys. Got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you Everyday Millionaires. We want that to definitely be the next chapter in your story. And I think you're well on your way.

And the good news is, Larry, you're going to get a better car later. Yeah, they've already got that.

Oh, good, good. I love it. Well, I want you to have a good car, people driving a car and go, that's my Dave car. I went, wait a minute, you're right. You're Dave cars. When you get rich and buy anything you want. Come on. Not your Dave car. So let's get the kids in the picture before we do the scream and introduce some Phoenix. Noah and Lily are with us to do the debt free scream together with her mom and dad.

The Knicks couldn't make it today. Oh, no. And Lily will be here today. Perfect shout out to Phoenix del Mar.

This will still mark the day. All right. Count it down. Let Sarah debt free scream three to one.

We're debt free. But look, this is the Dave Ramsey Show. Anthony O'Neal Ramsey personality is my co-host today here on the air. This is the Dave Ramsey Show, Open Phones, a triple eight eight two five five two two five. Jason is with us in Detroit. Hi, Jason. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Hey, Dave, thanks for taking my call.

How are you? Better than I deserve. How can I help? Well, I had a question for you.

I've been working with a financial adviser. Advisor is giving me some advice. And I follow the show among Baby Steps seven currently. But he presented me with an idea that was a little outside the box. And I have term life insurance. I've been a. a whole life. But he presented me with this incident banking concept Jesus by hitting me Monday. Yeah, I have. Of money in a savings account and looking to rebalance my portfolio to get it to work a little bit harder.

But my risk tolerance is a little bit low. And he showed me how you can do this, where you over fund the whole life policy. You could access the money to break even in your 70s as a dividend outruns what you put into it. Yeah, it just doesn't seem like a terrible idea in that regard. But I just want to draw your take on why, you know, that might not be the best way to go.

The problem is that you where it gets confusing is that cutting Seona dividend, a financial adviser is this is an insurance guy. Well, he's he's both they have you know, it's one of the bigger companies like Northwestern Mutual or Prudential. Exactly. Yeah, OK, he's an insurance guy, he's not a financial adviser. OK, so because those are both mutual companies now, there are two types of life insurance companies, mutual and stock. OK, likely you bought your term unless you bought it from him from a stock company, a stock company.

Stockholders own the insurance company, a mutual company, which is PROO and Northwestern State Farm is mutual. Is the policyholders are actually the stockholders. OK, OK, so when the company makes a profit. The policyholders receive a dividend as if they were a stockholder and received a dividend. That makes sense, yeah. Now, follow the math here, if you are the owner of the company and you're also the customer of the company and the only place the company gets money is from the customers that are owners and they give you money from a profit, by definition, that means it's because they took too much from you as a customer.

There wouldn't have been a profit otherwise. OK, so the IRS has deemed, consequently, that mutual life insurance company dividends are not dividends in the true sense of a dividend that instead they are. And this is the IRS language, they are instead a refund of a deliberate overcharge. So they overcharge you in order to give you some money later to make you feel like you're making money off of them and it's absolute hogwash. It's a pass through mathematically.

It's pastor, it's it's the way it has to be. It's the legal definition of the freaking company and the IRS.

So, yeah, that's the thing I didn't love. You know, when you take the money back, you basically are paying an interest rate on it.

Exactly. And whose money is this? Right, that your bar or your borrowing your own money and you're paying them interest? Yep. This is happening banking for them. Yeah. Yeah.

The infinite banking concept is, is old school whole life done poorly? You need a real financial adviser, not an insurance broker that's trying to sell you a load of manure. And so, yeah, the other thing is, is that your cash values that are sitting there all die with you.

So whatever cash you put into this is equal zero at your death because they only pay the face value.

Proo does not have a policy. Northwestern Mutual does not have a policy that pays more than the face value except universal life. Bees, which are not an infinite banking products and universal product B is where they charge more than they usually charge, which basically buys the insurance so they can still keep your money is the way the math actually works on this. So you're dealing with one of the most expensive insurance products in the marketplace. If you're dealing with either one of those two companies, I would stay completely away from both of them there, everyone in the financial field except people that work for them.

We all think they're a joke. All of us, anyone who's academically trained or has any kind of CFP or anything else, when when someone says I work for Northwestern Mutual, we just kind of laugh and go, yeah, right.

You screw people every day.

Yeah.

So you need to get away from them and you need to go get a real financial adviser that can help you do some real investing that takes into consideration your low risk tolerance. Low risk tolerance does not lead you to losing your money, 100 percent of the cash invested at death. Yeah, that's a bad risk tolerance thing.

So you need to move on it. You need to move on.

But it comes and the whole thing of the dividends are paying for it is such a joke because the dividends are the refund of a deliberate overcharge. So who's paying for it? If you were getting dividends from if you own Home Depot stock and you got dividends from that, that Home Depot is making a profit, but they're making a profit off of their customers.

Yes. And I'm the owner of the investment. I get that dividend that's different than if I am the customer and I'm the stockholder. Thereby the only way I made a profit was off of me myself. So I pay you an extra hundred bucks and then you give me seventy of it and I'm supposed to feel great about that. Right, right. So that's what this amounts to. And so you guys are working with State Farm.

When you get your little dividend check, that's what it is. It's the refund of a deliberate overcharge. IRS verbatim says that. Yeah. And that's why you don't get taxed on it. If you get a dividend on Home Depot stock, you get taxed on it as income because it's real income.

You really made an investment and then you really made an income. So that's what's going on with that stuff. So do not buy anything in the life insurance world based on dividends. You look at the price, look at the structure of the policy, and you'll usually find that mutual companies, by the way, are the higher priced. Yeah. So when you go to a, quote, service like a Zander Insurance and you get quoted on term life insurance, you're going to find no mutual companies in the 42 different companies that they give you a quote from because they're not competitive.

That's why. Because they charge more so they can give some of it to you back later and make you feel like that you got something. That's really what it amounts to and that's why you won't find them. You're not competitive. Yeah.

Dave, you're fired up about this one, man. I'll tell you what pisses me off.

Infinite banking, my button o k infinite banking is for them the only lesson. The only thing that that agent has for his whole life is a need for your commission to be paid to him. Absolutely. That's the only whole life thing that is involved here. This these products are horrendous. Yeah.

And, you know, it's bad enough when they feed on the middle class, but that guy is a baby. Step seven, many probably millionaire. Yeah.

And and they create such a jumbled word picture that you can't cut through the B.S..

And yet, you know, the thing about him hears you knows what happened to him. It's interesting. You know, it didn't feel right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He felt it didn't he. He felt it.

And that's probably because he's going through our process and he knows what we teach. Well, it's not just that he didn't just say, well, Dave says it's wrong. Right. There's something wrong here. I just can't put my finger on it.

Yeah. Overpay and get money back. But I mean, you're right, though.

I don't know exactly what's wrong, but I smell a rat. Yeah. Which means there's a dead rat in the corner somewhere. I just hadn't found him yet or below to count. Something stinks in here. Yeah. Some stinks in here. Something got in the house and you know, I got a smell in here. What is it something you got. You can't find it. You can't put your finger on. But how many times have you been in a situation with a person or with a product, a financial product.

You know, you had one. You had one. You were buying an item. I won't say what it was on the air, but you got the smell off the people and you ran it three weeks ago.

What was it they tell me you got? Have I was it. I'm not going to because they might be listeners and I'm going to do that to you under the bus. Oh, say you walked out of a deal into a different deal not long ago. Yes, sir.

And what was it? Not the same thing. It was the Holy Spirit inside of you said, I smell a rat.

Something's not right. Something be wrong with these people.

I ran this deal, is there? I can't put my finger on it, but this deal is bad. Yes. And you ended up in another deal. There's a much better deal because you listened, even though you couldn't logically explain it. You could listen to your heart. Absolutely. Listen to the bell when the bell rings. It's called the Holy Spirit. Yeah, thanks. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Oh, man.

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