Ram U live from the headquarters of Ramsay Solutions. It's the Ramsay Show, where we help people build wealth, live a life worth living, do work that they love, have great relationships. All of it Triple 825-5225. It's triple 825225. We're taking real calls from real people who are going through all kinds of challenges in their life, and we're going to help you out. Our promise is to sit with you and walk alongside you as we figure out what's the next right step. Triple 8825-5225. I'm John Deloney, joined here by Jade Warshaw, and we're taking your calls on just about anything and everything. Let's run out to Salt Lake City and talk to the great and wonderful Stacy. What's up, Stacy?

Hi.

What's up?

Nothing much.

Just hanging out here with my son.

What's up with you?

We are just hanging out together too. How can we help?

I am calling because my husband and I can't afford childcare, and we're not succeeding financially. We're really struggling, and I'm just trying to figure out what better we can do than what we're already doing.

Wow. How many kids do you have?

One. He was a surprise, and he's eight weeks old.

Eight weeks? Wow. You guys are in the thick of it. Cool.

Yes.

So what's the solution now? Are you just staying home?

I'm on maternity leave. I'm supposed to be going back to work in about four weeks. I was full time. I'm still technically full time, but the hope is to go back part time, but it's retail, so it's in person. So I'm looking for something I could do remotely so I could stay home with him.

Okay.

And then my husband works in an office.

So is the issue that you're having a hard time finding the part time job that you want to make this work, or is the problem that you're having a hard time finding a daycare price that would work? In any case.

I'm having a hard time finding remote work. I'm hoping to work remotely full time. And also my husband knew I brought a lot of debt into the marriage, and we were working at paying it off. How much is it surprised us between car, personal and credit cards and school, probably between 30 and $40,000. We're working on the credit cards first. I just dealt with a lot of mental health struggles growing in my young adult years, and also I just grew up poor, so I just tried to learn on my own how to do it all, and I didn't fully succeed.

So 45,000 between those that you list?

Between 30 and 40.

Between 30 and 40. Okay. And does your husband have any debt or he's not bringing any into the relationship?

He didn't bring any other than his truck, but his parents are currently paying that.

And how much is that?

I'm not sure, just because it's not one of my current bills, but it was a used truck, and so I'm pretty sure it's like between ten and 15,000.

Okay.

Yeah, 15,000 at the most.

If you had to guess. I'm sorry, I'm just getting the particulars, so I get a lay of the land.

No, you're good.

If you had to guess between the two of you, because it sounds like you're not fully combined on your finances. It sounds like you kind of have a separate thing going on. But if you had to guess, what do you both make combined before you make these career changes? What was it before?

We were making about 4000 a month total. We work together, but we do have separate accounts at the moment, just because we never did combine them. But we work together on paying stuff, so I know we make about 4000. He pays rent and I pay pretty much everything else.

So let me clarify because a lot of people do this thing where it's like, I make my money, you make your money, and then we throw some of our money into this joint pile that pays all the bills. But there's also other money in my personal account that 4000. Is that all the money combined, or is that just bill money?

What does he do for a living?

Ironically, he works in finance.

He's a debt collector.

So he doesn't make enough money?

No, he doesn't make enough money. He just started his career and stuff.

He just ended that career because he's got to go make more money.

Yeah, I know he sometimes makes bonuses.

And stuff, but could care less about that. It's not enough.

Yeah. And I don't know that you can go to not working or even working part time. I think whatever you do, you're going to need to work full time until he's able to make that spread as well.

His mommy is still paying his truck payment. Could she watch your kid a few hours a day?

No, we're in different states.

Okay.

Yeah, we're in different states. And I am planning on working remotely full time as soon as I could find something. It's just a matter of finding something.

Okay.

And I'm just, like, running out of time. And how hard are you looking right now?

Are you sending out 1520 applications a day?

Probably not that many a day. Probably three or four a day. Just because taking care of my son and stuff. But I'm applying to as many as I can, and I'm reaching out to people and stuff like that.

If in four weeks, when your leave is over, if you haven't found that full time remote job, what do you think the plan of action would be in your mind? What's the course of action at that point? I'm hoping that's not the case, but if you find yourself in that situation, what would you do at that point?

I'll work evenings and weekends at my current job and probably do DoorDash during the day with my son and would.

That be enough to cover the daycare?

We aren't comfortable doing daycare, and I want him with me. And so whatever at work I want to do, it's something I could do with him. That's why I'm looking for remote work.

Here's the deal. You may have answered this question several years ago with some of your financial choices, and I know this is hard to hear, but you owe $45,000, not to mention whatever your husband owes.

More like 35.

Yeah, whatever it is. And here's the problem. A, you don't fully know what that number is, and you don't know what his number is. You don't know what exactly the amount of money you make is because you don't know if he has a separate account or if his mommy's sending him money to help with the you don't know.

I have access to his account, full access to his account, to the one.

Jade and I wouldn't have jobs if husbands and wives told each other the truth all the time about money.

That's right.

And so this isn't a math problem. This is a wife who is living the life of a single mom inside of her own house. And y'all have to get together, and he has to recognize he's got to go make a whole bunch more money. And he just started a career. That career does not provide for his family at this moment. And you want to stay home with this baby. You may have to work for a season to get that 35 grand knocked out so that you can afford to stay home with this baby.

Yeah.

And I know that's scary. I know that's hard. But we love you too much to not tell you the truth.

Right. You have a lot more years ahead of you with that baby. And it's easy to forget and think that it's just right now. But you've got years and years to stay at home with that kid.

She's got a big, big hole. All of this starts with you sitting down with your husband and saying, I'm so scared, I can't breathe. We have to put everything on the table and tell the truth.

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This is the Ramsay show. Triple 8825-5225. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw. Jade, what did you do?

I didn't do anything.

You did. You super did.

Look, I posted a video on Facebook specifically about how zero credit scores work, and these folks came for my life.

John dude, they were showering you with the hater aid.

So I was thinking, you know what? I usually stay out of the comments, or I'm pretty just nonchalant about it, but these comments were extra. And I was like, you know what? I need to clap back on this. So let's play the video so you guys can just see how innocent what I said was, and you can be on my side and then we'll chop it up.

All right, let's do it.

It usually takes about a year to see your credit score go down to absolute zero if you completely stop borrowing money. And here's the thing, if you dillydally with this and you're like, I'm going to keep that one credit card open, it's never going to go to zero. You're just going to have a bad credit score. And then when you try to go buy a house, you're going to run into problems. Look, yeah, I stand by that. I stand by that message. I prove that message.

All right? I'm going to read some of the hater aid.

All right, read it.

Chad says, these people are crazy. Zero credit score is not even possible.

Okay?

Tim says, this is absolutely not correct. You need to raise your credit score, not lower it. This explains so much about some people. Derek says, this kind of crap's annoying. While it's possible to buy a house without a credit score, it isn't worth the hoops. Okay? Better off with a credit score.

The next one's my favorite.

Yeah. Jacob says says the woman with tons of assets to lean on and has no need for.

My I'm coming out of my seat right now because and I did reply to that when I was like, oh, you must not know me or my story if you think I came from wealth and assets. Are you kidding me? I gotta throw my pin across the room.

Hold on. This cat says I swear the Ramsey team's advice on credited is the stupidest bitty beep ever. Good luck getting approved for Jack bitter beep with no credit. That's the whole point.

Here's my thing. Here's my thing, John, and this is crazy to me. People would rather be right about what they think and about what they know than be free, than be happy, than be better off in life. They'd rather be right about the fact that there's no other way to get ahead in society than to be strapped with debt for eternity. Like, you have to play the debt game. It's the only way to make it in America is to have a credit score. Are you kidding me? You'd rather be right about that? And I'm like, really? You want to be right about something that keeps you in slavery your entire life forever? It's that important to you?

And, dude, for all of human history, this is how governments captured their citizens, right? By giving them a plot of land and saying, when it's paid off, then it's all yours, then you're free the next year. It's like, oh, well, we had to raise the price, and they do that in perpetuity. And now we wear this score like we win something.

And I'm the only one. The folks in this room are some of the only ones in the United States in the world telling y'all, hey, there's a better way. And we try to do it with love. We try to tell y'all, hey, there's a better way. We want you to be free. We want to help you. We exist to help the people outside of these walls. And it's crazy that people clap back on me like I'm trying to hurt them. And they're not clapping back at the credit collectors. They're not clapping back at FICO or Experian or TransUnion. They're yelling at me when I'm the one going, hey, there's a way that you don't have to play this stupid game. You don't have to rack your family with debt. You don't have know, rob Peter to pay Paul and move this money over here and keep your credit around for X amount of years with X amount of varieties of credit with X amount of percentage. Like, that is a game. And the goalpost is constantly moving. And one of the things I noticed that they were mad at me is I said, hey, if you're going to run our plan, run it to the end zone.

Do it all the way. Don't do this mess of, well, I'm going to pay off my credit, but I'm going to keep a couple of cards open or keep that one card open just in case, because that'll jack your credit even worse, right? Because there are ways that they're measuring your credit. It's not just, hey, have one credit card open. You have to utilize that credit, and you have to keep it around for a long time, and you have to make sure the percentage is right. Otherwise, yeah, you'll have a score, but it won't be great. It'll probably be pretty bad. And the fact is, having a I'm a say it and I'm a scream it till the cows come home. Having a zero credit score is just as good, in my opinion, better than having a 750 or 800, because I don't have to play the game of debt. I get to be my own woman, my own man, my husband, and we're autonomous, and we are free, and we don't have to be slaves to the system. So if you don't like that, you can go ahead and put that yoke back on.

And they can yeah. And you'll just pull the plow of debt for them, and you can do that the rest of your life. I'm not going as for me and.

My house, making other people rich at your expense. Look, hey, can we run through this real quick?

Yeah.

These people are crazy. Zero credit score is not even possible. False. False.

It's false. Once you pay off your debt, like I said, and you close the accounts. You've got to close them. It takes about six to twelve months for your credit score to roll to zero. That's how it goes.

This is absolutely not correct. You need to raise your credit score, not lower it.

Why?

False. Why?

You tell me why.

So that one day you can go get on both knees and hold your hands up and say, dear Lender, please, please. And they'll say, well, let me look in my secret file and see what your score is.

Yeah.

Instead of sitting down with your wife when your air conditioner goes out and you have become your own bank over 15 years, which is what took me and my wife. And your argument is not, please, please, can I it's you call. I'm not calling you. I don't want to call you call. I love it. That's the most annoying fight you have.

Yeah.

Right?

And I think people forget the fact that when you decide, John, like, hey, we're going to pay off our debt, that simultaneously means and we're not going back into debt and we're not doing this thing called credit anymore. And the biggest argument is, yeah, but if you don't have a credit score, how are you going to live? And the biggest two areas that people are thinking about are cars and living situation. Right. Can you buy a car without credit? Yes, you can. It's called buying a car in cash. And I'm not talking about that. You always have to save $40,000 or $50,000 to buy the newest model. The cars that Sam Warshaw and Jade Warshaw drive are from 2013. And I think we paid less than, I don't know, 20,000 for both. Yeah. Each of them. That's how you do this. And don't get me wrong, I could have way more car than that. John, at this point in my life, I just don't care about it that much. So don't tell me it's not possible. You save up your money and it takes time. Let me just say this. My husband and I, for the first time in our marriage are a two car family.

And that happened last year because that's just the life we chose. We didn't have to do that for that long. But we said, you know what? I don't care about going into debt over cars. And when we feel like paying up cash and buying a second car, we will. And that's what you're talking about. You just choose.

It was up until this year, I went from a 96 to a 2012, and I was driving 2012 forever.

Yeah.

And Dave, just Dave, as my friend, goes, hey, I know what I pay you.

Right?

What are you doing? And he's like, you're trying to make a point? And I go, I honestly don't, I don't care. And it was only that I was like, I'm going to get and by the way, I went all in on a Highlander and, dude, every day I get in it, I smile so big like I've beat somebody, like I've won some game. And my buddies are like, It's not a cool car, John.

Come on.

I know, but it doesn't have a CD player in it anymore, right? Here's the deal. When you unhook yourself from the external expectation yeah. My wife likes me. And you know how I know she likes me? Because she was dating me when I was driving an 88 herself. Easy, Hatchback. Let's go. I know. This is love, right? And that when we were making it. When Dave was paying us more money than any Deloney's had ever wrapped their head around. I didn't need to prove anything to anybody. No, it's not a game, right? It's like, yeah, I was able to cobble together the money and pay for that in cash, and it's mine.

The money doesn't determine your worth.

Hey, one more thing.

What about housing? Let me hit this right quick. People think you can't buy a house with a zero credit score. Yes, you can. It's called manual underwriting. I did it. John Deloney did it. George Campbell did it. I know Rachel Cruz did it. All these folks did it. All you need is payment history. Twelve months showing your trade lines, cell phone bills, utilities. You need actual money. You need to show twelve months of bank statements and just your last 30 days.

But that's so many hoops.

It's almost the same as the normal process.

It's not. Hey, by the way, Churchill Mortgage is.

The place to go, guys.

Yes. And, man, if you just weren't so rich, you wouldn't be able to talk like this. Jade this episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Hey, folks, it's Dr. John Deloney. This time of year can be hard, and seasonal affective disorder is real. When I moved to Nashville, the time change caught me off guard. It got dark at like, 430, and I was ready for bed by 06:45. P.m.. Things weren't as fun. Even the food lost its flavor. Now I know how to prepare my body. When things get dark, I go outside to enjoy nature. I stick to an exercise routine, and I intentionally connect with people. Another thing I did is therapy. Therapy can be a bright spot even when the sun goes down too soon. Something positive and interactive to make us feel grounded and give us the tools to manage the way seasonal change can affect our bodies. So if you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. BetterHelp is flexible because it's totally online, so it can fit into any schedule. Just fill out a short questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist. You can switch therapists at any time for no charge.

Find your bright spot this season with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com Deloney today to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. He lp.com deloney. This is the Ramsay show. Triple 825-5225. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw. Let's go out to Destin, Florida, and talk to Josh. What's up, brother? Josh.

Hey, how you doing?

Good, man. How are you? I'm okay.

I appreciate you taking the call.

You got it, man. What's up?

I guess I'll cut right to it. So I've been following you guys for a little while, trying to get my finances on track. But I've come to a decision. I need to start handling my life and get some stuff on track, and I want to go to rehab so I can quit my drinking.

Dude, I'm proud of on. Hold on. Don't blow by that. That's huge. What led you here? There are millions and millions of people in the United States that need to make this decision, and I want them to hear where you landed. You'll be a gift.

In the past, I battled with other substance abuse issues, and I let that go. I've been clean from all that, and I just kind of picked up the bottle, and I'm just tired of it. Tired of doing the same things over and over again. Tired of relying on something to feel like I need it to function.

Awesome. I'm proud of you, man. I'm proud of you. So how can we help?

Well, pretty much my insurance situation. The only way to get into treatment, it covers most of it, except for about $6,000, $6,000, depending on location. So really not trying to get into any more debt.

Sure.

But I want to take care of this.

The first question I would ask is often, and I'm talking about rehab places that are not like, go to Malibu or you're in Destin, not like a beachfront place that's going to be a resort. Okay. Yeah. Often, if you sit down, places will waive the gap between the insurance and the cash out. Okay. It's the equivalent of a scholarship program. So I would have that conversation with the place. Have you done that?

Been calling and asking for scholarships? I've called hundreds of places.

Probably you haven't called. Maybe a slight exaggeration, but yeah, a big exaggeration. Okay.

Yes.

And nobody will waive the gap?

No. That'll cover my insurance.

What do you mean?

Because the cheapest thing I've been able to find is a $6,000 copay.

Is that your deductible?

Yes, that's the cheapest thing I can get. I've applied for scholarships.

Okay.

They're saying they're not doing it.

So do you have guns or guitars or a truck? You have something you can sell?

No, I mean, I've got a truck, but it's my work truck.

Can you go down in value on it? What's it worth?

No, I'm upside down in it.

What's it worth?

Probably about eleven grand.

What do you owe on it?

About 200,000 miles on it. Twelve?

What would happen you owe twelve, it's worth eleven. What would happen if you sold that and went down half the value and just bought yourself a little truck? That'll get you is there anything do you see what I'm saying? Like, this is temporary.

I get what you're saying, but it's a truck with 200,000 miles on it, and not that many people are going to spend $11,000.

Well, if it's worth $11,000, there's a.

Whole bunch of people will, my friend. They're in your situation, too. What about a parent or family member?

No. Unfortunately, no.

Okay. So here's what I would tell you. I would start if I'm you in this situation, I would start with a couple of different areas. Number one, I would walk in this evening to the local AA meeting. Have you done that yet? Yeah. Okay. I would ask around and tell them I've got a Gap, and my guess is there's people who would say, I know X, Y, and Z. I know this person. My church has a sponsorship program. There's gap payment here. We can help figure this out. I would start there. Okay.

Okay.

And this is you being super vulnerable. It sounds like you're so sick of all this that you're kind of done giving a crap. Is that fair?

Absolutely.

Okay. The second thing is I'm going to give you three months of free. BetterHelp. I want you to talk to a licensed counselor. I want you to hang on the line here, and I want you to make sure that just full stop, rehab is the right next move for you. Okay? They might say, hey, I want you to go every day to a meeting in the evening and in the morning for 30 days, and let's circle back before we make this big leap, okay? Okay. The third thing is I want you to be honest, deeply honest with what you can part with right now, because here's what I'm trying to avoid. I don't want you to come out on the other side of a 30 day intreatment program or a 28 day outpatient program and have that clarity of mind, that sobriety, the light is on, and then that credit card bill hits you right in the mouth. That's what I want to avoid at all cost.

And that's another thing I'm worried about, is finances. Bills keep coming.

They do keep coming.

Even been looking into detoxes, and it's still about that same number just for, like, a week. Detox.

They do. I want you to go to a meeting, and I want you to be vulnerable and raise your hand and say, I'm stuck. Okay. Yeah. If you tell me after 30 days of knocking on every door, put your car on Facebook Marketplace and see if you can get $6,000 for it or $7,000 or $11,000, that's going to give you six grand, and you go buy a $5,000 car with 250,000 miles on truck, I get it. Not pretty. This is a Band Aid. I get it. If you tell me you can't, then I would say, then go to a local credit union and figure out that gap or before you did that, I would see if you could work out a payment plan with the rehab place. Probably they won't do that, but it'd be worth a shot.

Oh, no, they will do that. That's why I was no interest, but that's why I was on the call, because I've already got other debt racked up.

Okay. I'm okay with that one. If the last option and listen to me, this is not a pass for you just to go, sweet. I can go. I want you to exhaust every avenue, because my brother Jade and I have sat with people, they walk out, and then reality is a cold dose of water, and it's easy to fall right back into old habits when old fists hit you in the same mouth.

Yeah.

Because even if you can find a couple of thousand even if you can find a couple of thousand from selling things, you visit a local church and say, hey, is there a ministry here? What can I do? Can I serve to earn this money? Whatever you can figure out, even if you're closing that gap with cash in some way, that's going to be worth it to you.

Or if you got two weeks and you decide, I'm going to wake up at 05:00 every morning and drive Uber, and I'm going to work like mad and earn this money. Right. There's going to be some little victories there, but if you tell me, hey, man, I'm underwater right now. I'm wanting to go to rehab because I'm drinking every day and I can't stay clean. I get that, and I honor that. Okay. But I want you to go to a meeting tonight, and I want you to raise your hand and ask that question. Okay? Okay. If the hospital where you are doing your inpatient rehab is willing to say there's an interest free option here for the gap, then I'm okay with that. As a last defcon resort option, if a clinical supervisor has said your only option is rehab. Okay. So I want you to hang on the line. I want you to walk through when you go through the BetterHelp. I want you to click on struggling with Substance Abuse, Struggling with Alcohol, and I want you to put in the notes trying to make a decision on whether I need to go to rehab, go to inpatient rehab counseling.

And then when they reach out, they're going to walk you through an assessment and you all can make that decision together. Is that cool?

Yeah, that's awesome. Thank you so much. I appreciate everything.

Hey, I need you to hear me say I'm really proud of you.

Me, too.

Thank you.

This is real hard.

Very much.

You've been drowning for a long time, haven't you? Yeah. We're done.

Okay.

Are we done with all the drinking?

Yes, I want to be. I mean, I'm tired of it.

Good. Hey, I'm going to put a. Little star on this. I want you to call back in 30 days with your 30 day chip and we're going to celebrate you on the air. All right? I'm proud of you, my man. This is the Ramsay show. We'll be right back.

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Triple 825-5225. This is the Ramsay show. Hey, it's almost a holiday season and if you are already getting sweaty armpits thinking about Thanksgiving with family and Christmas, I got you. We've created some new questions for humans. This year's. We have a Thanksgiving deck to talk about gratitude. You can sit down at Thanksgiving table and look around and say, no politics, nobody cares. No negative nonsense on this one. No TVs, everybody put your stupid phones down. We're going to ask these questions and it's for the whole family. We also made a new Christmas deck. And what's super rad, we made a new deck. And this is because you asked for it. For grandparents and kids, it's a great way for you and your spouse to go out to dinner and say, mom, dad, you can be with the grandkids and don't be weird. Here are some cards we got you. Go to Ramsaysolutions.com and save your holidays.

I love that.

Let's go out to Detroit Rock City and talk to Sarah. What's up, Sarah?

Hi, how are you guys today?

Good, how are you?

I'm doing amazing, thanks for asking.

Awesome. What's up?

I am calling because I am debating on if I should move or if I should stay in my current home. We currently have a home where we owe about $130,000 on it. We have a great interest rate of only 2.25%, but we have some structural issues going on in our basement, my husband and I. Yeah. And it's going to be really expensive. How expensive it's going to be maybe like around $70,000. The person who sold us the home was not 100% truthful about the issues that were going on. And he covered up some stuff.

Sounded like he was 0% truthful.

Actually, we're dealing with some foundational issues and he covered it up with cement. So it got past me, my husband, the inspector, it got past everyone. And now we're in jeopardy of losing.

Our homeowners insurance if you don't get it repaired.

Exactly. And they're giving us like a very short window to get it repaired.

What's the window?

Like three months.

What? Dang, son, if you were to let go of this house, let's pretend you did sell it what would it bring?

15,000.

15,000?

Yes.

And how long have you lived in this house?

We moved in in 2020.

Okay.

How much would it bring you?

Well, from the suggestions of my realtor, the house is worth based on the area, the house is worth a lot more than what we would list it for, but due to the foundational issues yeah. She's thinking that we should list the house at 159. But if we were to possibly try and at least do part of the repairs and maybe speak to the homeowner insurance company and see if maybe they can work something out with us.

I'm wondering about that. I'm wondering if you and your husband sit down and put together a plan of phases and say, hey, in phase one, this is what we're getting done, and here's the time frame for that. And then phase two starts at X date, and here's what we're doing there. And here's the twelve month plan or whatever month plan for this to be completely fixed and healed.

Yeah. Did you all try to report it as an insurance loss and they came out and went through everything and then they tagged you for even bringing a mistake? Yeah, that's happened to me before, too.

And when they came out, we were thinking that maybe they would cover it, and they were like, no, we're not going to cover it and we're not going to renew. Pretty much is what happened.

Yeah. Hate that, man. You can't even ask a question anymore and they'll just burn you while you're doing this. Jade's is what I would do if I'm sitting down with my wife, if I'm being honest, trying to put skin in this game, I would sit down with my wife and say, okay, we don't have $70,000. I'm assuming you don't have $70,000 in cash.

Oh, absolutely not.

Okay.

Do you have any money right now?

At the moment, no. We're currently working on the baby step. We've paid off all of my husband's credit card, and we're paying off mine as well.

What do you have left to go on the debt?

Maybe like around 20.

Okay.

And can I just ask you guys'combined income? 100 and 2120. So 20,000 left in debt, 120 income. Yeah.

We're pausing this right now. You think?

Jade I think you have to. If they're giving you three months before you lose your insurance, you got to move this to the top of the list. Or at the very least, like I said, you've got to come up with this plan of action, find out what they're going to do. Now, let's give her option B.

Option B is I want you to call my friends at Xander Insurance. Okay? And here's what Xander is. They're a broker and they call a whole bunch of different companies and get you the best rates. And I want you to be honest and talk with the broker and say, we got some foundation issues, we called our insurance company and then they did this to us. And let them walk you through what the next step is. If they tell you, I'm sorry, this means your house is completely uninsurable. Well, now you know. But I bet that's not going to be the case.

Got it.

Okay. And that gives you option two. Here is not option three. I don't want you going out and borrowing $70,000 on this house.

That's right.

Okay. You think you're stressed now?

That's not passion.

Well, yeah. You think you're stressed now? You go upside down on your house, on foundation repair, and you're not going to be able to sleep or breathe. Okay?

Yeah.

Okay. I love the idea of sitting down, getting one or not one, getting two or three different quotes on this and have them do it in stages. And what they're going to want to do is come do it all at the same time. You can look at them and smile and say, I'm going to pay for cash as I go. I need you to break this up into have to have right now, right this second. What's stage two? What's stage three? And on and on and on. Okay.

Okay.

Yeah. Look, these are those moments where being brutally honest with whoever's coming to your house and doing those estimates, because there's a real person on the other side of that. Right. And if you say to them, hey, this is going to cost $70,000, here's what the insurance told us. We cannot afford to lose this house, our interest rate. We can't go into another market where the interest rate is going to be 7%. If you start talking like that to a human being and you're showing that you're a human being, too, a lot of times you will be surprised at what they're able to meet you at. And if you can have them kind of shift into your shoes of like, what would you do? And is there any way? Because if you were in this situation, it seems like you would want to do the same thing. If you can get them thinking like that, that's good.

And by the way, $70,000 on $150,000, home. What are they doing, man? Are they going to lift your whole house and redo all the blocking underneath the whole thing?

Yeah, that's the thing, too, where we've had, like, three people to come out and give estimates, and 70,000 was, like, at the top of the list. But three of them are saying three different things. One is saying, oh, we can just waterproof it. The other one is saying, oh, we can put beams up and push the wall out. And then the third one is saying, we have to redo the entire wall.

Of course.

Let me ask you this, Sarah. How do you feel about it? Because I'm listening to you talk and I'm like, dude, if I was in my house and they're telling me there's structural damage and what my house can crumble on me and my family. There is part of me, john, that's like, get me out. I don't trust any of y'all to make sure that this is right, especially if y'all are all telling me something different. Does that hit a nerve at all?

It did at first. We were actually in the process of trying to move and list our house, but when I just looked at the numbers, it just didn't seem worth it to me. As Dave ramsey always said, I'd rather eat beans and rice and just thug it out, keep my current home because I love the home that we're in.

There you go.

That's what you do.

It may be that you have to bite the bullet on this one and pay to have it waterproof so you can get it through the insurance. And then you're going to have to save up money and have them come put peers in that wall and lift the house up and level it and go with peers. And that's going to not only get you through inspection, but the whole house is going to be structurally sound. Right. And, yes, it would be cool if I could do a complete frame off restoration of my truck. I can't afford to do that, but I can replace the shocks, right? And it's going to drive great and it's going to be safe. And so it might be finding some middle ground over time. But call our friends at xander and get some updates on the insurance because you may want to tell your insurance company, you know what? I fire you. I fire you. Hey, this is the first hour in the books. We'll be right back on the ramsay show.

Listen, folks, this show has always been about you and for you, so we want to hear from you right now. The ramsay show annual survey is live. Text survey to 33789 or go to ramsaysolutions.com slash survey. When you fill out the survey, you'll be entered to win a $500 gift card. That's survey text it to 33789. Thanks for helping us understand how to serve you best.

Live from the headquarters of ramsey solutions, it's the ramsey show, where we help people build wealth, wealth get out of debt, do work that they love and create incredible relationships and speak clearly. We help with that, too. I'm John deloney, joined here by my friend jade Warshall. And we have the lines open. Triple 8825-5225. That's triple 825-5225. Let's run out to new hampshire and talk to dylan. What's up, dylan? How are we doing?

Hey, I just had a quick question for you both. I'm assuming, John, you'll be able to answer this a little better, but you.

Might way smarter than me.

Well, we'll see how it goes. So it would seem that my mom is boycotting my rehearsal and my rehearsal dinner because I changed a small plan.

I don't know. I might be able to answer this one because I know about that.

Dude, I'm laughing with you, man. What'd you do, Richard? What did you change that was so bad?

So I'll run it quick. So back months ago when we gave them the opportunity to kind of plan the dinner, it's not what we wanted originally. We told them we just wanted to have pizza and go back to the airbnb and just have a good time with the bridal party. Well, my mom absolutely insisted on paying for this and making a big dinner, and we go out and all this and that. Obviously, listening to you guys, I try to save as much money as possible, but she wasn't on board with that. And I gave her the opportunity for months and months and months. And a few days ago, I talked to her and told her, I'm like, hey, we're really thinking about switching back to our original plan. And I was like, I'll give you a few days to figure it out. Well, I just waited one day and I was like, you know what? I should do what I really want to do. It's my special day, of course, my fiancee's, too. And I decided I'm like, hey, this is what we're going to do instead.

I didn't see this coming, but I want to lean on you a little bit and you push back, okay? Of course. Why would you take this from your mom? It's like a dinner that she's paying for.

Well, just because it's originally not what we wanted. I should add to this, too. She started inviting a bunch of people that we didn't want.

There.

There it is.

Okay. Lead with that, brother. Lead with that. Because that changed.

But that wasn't the biggest issue, I don't think. It's that she didn't really respect that we originally wanted to do something else. That's how I took it.

Dylan, is there strings attached to this? As in I'm doing this for you? So somewhere down the line, there's going to be an expectation of something I want from there.

I'm not going to go as far as that, but it's not.

It. All right, so here's the deal. As heartbreaking and complicated as this is, this is very simple. You made a grown up choice. And with all grown up choices, there always comes grown up consequences to those choices. Unfortunately, your mom is choosing to act like a child. And I mean that. With all due respect, I don't like talking about people's mamas, but here we are.

Oh, I've said it a few times.

So one of the hardest things I think any of us will experience is when somebody we love opts out of relationship with us because they are choosing to be immature, because they are making our whatever, how we're raising our kid, what school our kid goes to, our choice of diet, whatever you want to say. They make our lives about them, and she is choosing to not be in relationship with you and your wife during your big day, and that just hurts. And so it's a both. And I want you to spend time, even just for a few minutes, saying, like, this sucks, man. I want my mom in my wedding. I hate that she's acting like this. And you and I both know she acts like this on other things too. This isn't isolated, right?

No, not at all.

Awesome.

And can I add something? Of course she's going to come to your dinner. Well, I think she's going to come.

I'm hoping so.

I would write her a letter so bad.

I would write her a letter that she can go back to over and over and over again and say it would mean the world to us that you come. I know that you wanted a big thing, and I'm so grateful that you're honoring us with this one. We really want you here.

Yeah. The thing is that she won't even come to the rehearsal, which is the worst part to me. I'm okay if she didn't want to come to the dinner.

She's saying that rowdy and everything. She's saying that, and I don't know her, so I may be totally off base. I think that this is her last ditch effort to get her way on this. And I would probably be willing to put couple I put some chips on the table on this that she's going to end up there. I don't think she's going to miss her son's major days over this. Now, maybe I don't know her and I'm completely wrong, but something tells me that when the rubber hits the road, she's going to be there.

What about your old man? Have you talked to him about it?

Yeah, I actually spoke to him today, and he just initially it's the first time. Also keep in mind my mother won't talk to me at all. She will not talk to me, of course.

Well, you ruined her life, jerk. Yeah, absolutely ripping her heart out.

But I did speak to my dad this morning, and he was saying that she just feels hurt and that it doesn't have anything to do with the dinner, which I don't believe, because this kind of stuff has happened before where she doesn't get her way, which I don't believe.

Well, he's probably been covering her for her for a long time too, right?

Oh, of course. Yeah. Obviously he has to take her side in most cases, and I don't blame him. But yeah, I spoke to him.

She won't talk to you. The best I can tell you is what I would do in your situation, and that would be I would write a letter, and I would do my best to deliver it by hand if you all live in the same community. Put it in her mailbox by hand.

I was at her house yesterday okay.

And let her have something. Because, listen, if you call her, if you text her, she is going to hear that one time through her filter of dylan is trying to ruin my life and Dylan's going to embarrass me because I'm in charge of the dinner and everyone's going to ask me why I just did pizza. And it's all about her. But if you write it down, people can go back to the letter and back to it and back to it. And sometimes not always, but sometimes that truth has a way of distilling itself down and she can rest in he wants me there. Him and his wife are just trying to do things a little bit differently. It's not about me, et cetera. And you hope that's the case, but we all have that's what I'm hoping.

But that's a great idea.

And tell your dad we really want both of you all there.

I told him that. I told him that this morning when I spoke to him. I'm like, if the worst case scenario happens, I'm like, please, dad, be at my wedding at the very least. It's pretty crazy.

I hate it for you.

I appreciate it. Thank you, though. But, yeah, that was pretty much it. I appreciate you guys.

Yeah. It's not every day I get to talk to somebody who just willy nilly rips his mom's heart out. Right, Jay?

Dude, look, when it comes to these weddings, it's like that. If I had done what all the parents had wanted, I would have been married in a different state. I would have gotten married on a different date. I would have gotten married in a different dress. Like, they all have their preferences, but at the end of the day, it is your day.

And sometimes it's just a dinner. Do the dinner. But if it is that big of a deal, you made a grown up choice and that comes with grown up consequences. Hey, this is the Ramsey show. We'll be right back. Fake it till you make it. It's popular career advice, but it doesn't work for very long. If you don't love what you do, you can't fake the enthusiasm and energy you need to win at work. You also can't fake your physical health and energy. Everybody knows we should eat more fruits and veggies, but fruit chews and veggie tips don't count. If you aren't winning physically, I promise you're limiting your opportunities to win professionally. Folks, I know you're going hard right now to pay off debt and get ahead professionally, you need another gear. And that's why balance of nature will help you. They help me. They give me the benefits of fresh, whole fruits and veggies in just seconds. The blend of 31 different fruits and veggies is powdered in an advanced process that locks in the nutrients. So go to balanceofnature.com and enter the promo code ramsay to get 35% off your first order and lock in a lifetime price as a preferred customer.

That's balanceofnature.com with the promo code Ramsay for 35% off your first order. This is the Ramsay show. What's up? We're so glad you're with us. Triple 825-5225. Hey, Jade. I'm reading this CNN.com article says Americans ran up $105,000,000,000 in credit card interest last year alone, and about one in about 10% of general purpose credit card accounts in the United States were in what they call persistent debt, which is this loop you can't get out because the interest and fees are more than the minimum payments.

Yeah.

Wow. It says the industry uses rewards to get you in. You think you're going to pay everything off every month, but then some things don't go as planned. That's the whole purpose of this show. People get stuck. It just gets in this loop. And this is just the people in persistent debt. This does not include the other 90% that are locked in at some shape, form, or fashion to become part of their life.

That's right.

You and Rachel Cruz have partnered up with Every Dollar, the greatest budgeting app in the universe, to do some trainings. Tell us about them.

That's right. So you're going to hear us talk about this all the time. This is something that we're doing consistently. About two times a month, we're hosting webinars here at Ramsey Solutions. They're totally free. And the Webinars are to teach you how to budget, because we hear I mean, for a lot of people, budgeting is a new concept, or if it's not completely new, you were doing it before, but you didn't realize you were doing it the wrong way. That's why it wasn't working for you. So we're giving up an hour and a half of our time, couple of times a month, so that you can get this knowledge and so that you can break free from that paycheck to paycheck cycle so that you can learn how to budget. And not just with any app. We want you to learn how to budget with Every Dollar. And so not only is the webinar free, but you can download Every Dollar and start using that app for free. So we want to help you guys, and this is how we're going to do it. All you need to do is show up. It's during your lunch break.

I say it all the time. You can sit and eat your sub sandwich. You can eat your Lean Cuisine, and no one's going to know that you have broccoli in your teeth because you're going to be on the interwebs with us. You don't have to show your face. You can just get this good knowledge and change your life.

And I just want to talk to the folks out there who are rolling their eyes if I say something like, hey, how do you lose weight? And a friend of mine who's Dr. Lane Norton, one of the best nutritionists on the planet, says diet and exercise. I can know. Thanks. Right? And of course, there's so much more to it than that. But I look at someone like that, like Lane who's ripped, he wins these awards, he's got a PhD in it. And I just think to myself, I'm just going to go figure it out, right. And I don't have the courage to say, I need some help. Can you walk me through this? And he's a friend of mine, so he'll walk me through. At the microscope level, at the macro level, this is very similar. It's easy to say, okay, I'll make a budget. Okay. The reality is if people knew how to do this, we wouldn't have this mess 100%. Right. And so have the courage to be vulnerable and say, all right, I'm going to tune in. I'm going to go to EveryDollar.com budgeting. EveryDollar.com budgeting. I'm going to sit there for an hour and a half and I'm going to actually get the tools on how to do this.

Yeah.

And if you don't want to talk, you don't have to talk. You can let everybody else do the talking or if you're like, no, I have specific questions. You can put those questions in the chat. We answer them. Or you can come on live and you can actually talk with us and ask your questions. So this is super interactive. And like you said, this is not just us saying, yeah, spend less money than you make. This is us going in and giving you the actual recipe. Okay, here's how you go in and actually do it. These are the macro steps in order to get this done.

And by the way, micro, this is me just again being vulnerable. I have taken the headset off on this very stage that I'm sitting on right now and asked Dave a budgeting. Asked. I've called George and said, hey, man, how do I I do this for a living and I'm still getting some coaching. And so there's no shame in the game. Just seek peace in your life. And if you don't have the skills, go to WW, dot EveryDollar.com budgeting. And I also understand that I make myself look 108 years sound 108 years old. When I said www, you did go to EveryDollar.com budgeting sign up. The seats are limited. So get up there and do it and join Jay. Join Rachel for one of these budgeting trainings, man. Get it done. Get it done. Get it done. All right. The neighborly question of the day. The question of day is sponsored by neighborly, your hub for home services. When a disaster like a fire or flood strikes, Neighborly's rainbow restoration offers homeowners full restoration services, plus mold remediation, carpet cleaning, odor removal and more. Download the neighborly app now to find rainbow restoration services near you.

All right, today's question comes from Manuel in Arizona. He says, I'm getting married to the love of my life. I am Mexican American born in the US. And raised in Mexico. I'm a dentist, and I'm also on track to pay off my student loans in the next year. I make about $300,000 a year. My fiance is an endodontist in Mexico. When we get married, she has agreed to move to the US. With me, which means she will no longer be able to practice dentistry. We have talked about this, and she has agreed to become a stay at home wife, especially when we have kids. I make enough money to be able to support a family, but I'm afraid of my wife not being able to adjust to not making money. Yeah. What is the best way to handle this and allow her to keep some individuality when it comes to finances? She has worked really hard to become a doctor and she has made good money in Mexico as an endodontist the last few years. It will be a big change to have to depend on me financially. Oh, Lord. Look, I'm going to say something brief and then I'm going to let John take this away.

The biggest and best thing you can do is to flip the script and put yourself in her shoes. And how would it feel if you moved countries and let go of a degree that you worked really hard for and a career path that you worked very hard for, that you enjoy doing? When I hear the words that says, she agreed to move to the US. And she agreed that she will no longer be able to practice dentistry, there's part of that. And she has agreed to become a stay at home wife. There's part of that that makes it seem like this was your suggestion.

And she's like, okay, they're working through a contract.

Yeah, go ahead, John. No, you keep going just as a woman. There is part of that that's like the way this sounds, the way it's worded, and it might be the way it's worded is. It does sound to me like on down the line, she could look up and feel resentful and feel like I gave up everything for this. And I'm not sure that I wanted to do that. And where is your sacrifice?

There you so in my house, my wife was Dr. Deloney before I was yeah. And then when we made a move for my job and me trying to get my head screwed back on straight when I was struggling with mental health stuff, she went to work part time at a local school, and so she went from Dr. Deloney to Haymiss in one year.

Wow.

And then she went to, hey, I'm going to stay at home for a season. And now she's an author and coaches women, does a bunch of their stuff. But all along the way, there was this big identity shift and there was some big changes. And what I've come to find out by just sitting with countless women over the. Last decade. There's no way to win, right? You're not a home enough or you're home too much, or you need to be making more money or how dare you make money instead of there's just a guilt industry designed to keep women from ever getting both feet on the ground.

I'm here for that.

And so I think what I've learned, Manuel, through my trial and error and I've made many, many mistakes along the way, is I want to back up 30,000ft and know this anxiety is your body trying to anticipate future train wrecks and solve them in the present. So you are going into this trying to reverse engineer what might happen, what she might feel like, challenges she might have down the road. That's going to be a recipe for disaster. What I want you both to do is to say every 30 days, we're going to check in on this transition. How can I best love you right now and expect there to be loss? There's grief. I was a doctor, and now I'm sitting at home cleaning up, spit up all day long. Or maybe she's free. Maybe she hated being a doctor.

True.

So she gets to drive that. And I want you to create, Manuel, a home where it's okay for her to be sad on some days, for her to be cheering on some days. And your question all the time is, how can I love you this week? How can I love you next week? And when she says, hey, this staying at home thing's, not for me, let's have that conversation then. But let's don't try to predict every bad thing and try to solve it right now, because you're going to create chaos and anxiety in your house week by week, month by month, year by year. This is the Ramsay show. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsay show. I'm John Deloney, joined by Jade Warshaw Triple 825-5225. Let's go out to Indianapolis and talk to Madison. What's up, Madison?

Hello.

How are we doing?

Good.

I have a question. So I'm wondering if I should sell my personal car and just use my boyfriend's company car, his personal car, to pay off some of my debt.

You want to sell your car to use your boyfriend's company car? Correct. I don't think that that's a good idea.

This doesn't end well.

Yeah, because this is where my mind goes. I'm going to just say it. What happens if you get in an accident in your boyfriend's company car, which means the company is paying for him to use it for work transportation, so.

I have coverage through his work. We actually work for the same company.

Do you have coverage on his vehicle or you have coverage because you just work there like you're listed on his vehicle?

Correct, on both of them. So his personal car and his company car, I have coverage.

Okay. So it's completely kosher.

Yes.

And my car essentially is just sitting in the driveway right now and I don't touch it. So I don't know if I'm losing money by it just sitting there. I still owe on it, so I'm still making payments, but I don't know if it's beneficial to just have my car sitting here and not use it.

Or if I should sell it.

I think that's independent from him. I'm more nervous about you're going to be very exposed. Okay. When I say this, you're going to go, not us. It would never happen.

No, I know, I understand.

But you know what I mean.

That's why I wanted to ask yeah.

If you're my sister or you're my daughter, or you're just one of my buddies who's a woman, I would tell you if he marries you, great. Y'all make financial decisions together and y'all, go in and share a car and all that. Yeah, if it's a mean jade and I would not have jobs if every well laid plan ended. Right. And so you're selling your car, exposing yourself to him and his company, which happens to be your company, too. That's just a lot of you are hitching your wagon to some unsecure horses and getting dragged into the wild. Right. That just makes me nervous.

What's your car worth that's sitting in the driveway?

About 9000.

9000? Is it paid off or you have payments on it still?

I'm still making payments, so that's my biggest thing is I'm paying insurance. I'm making my monthly payments, and I'm not using it.

And how much do you still owe on it?

About $5,000.

Yeah. I'm going to keep it.

I'd pay it off.

Yeah, keep it and pay it off.

How quickly can you pay it off?

So that's kind of the second part of this. I have some debt and I just don't know how to approach my debt. And what's the most important thing to pay off first?

Okay, let's figure that out. List your debts for me just however they come to mind.

Okay, so I have credit card, which is about $3,000.

Okay.

So we actually have a house. So do you want me to include my mortgage?

Who's listed on the both of us? Both of you are listed on it, yes. All right, we'll get to that in a minute.

All right. Madison courthouse this weekend.

Yeah, we'll deal with that.

Protect yourself.

Yes. Okay, what else?

Appliances. We have about 4000.

Oh, Lord.

Okay, keep going.

And then my car was about 5000. And then I have medical debt, and that's a big one. And I've paid a lot of it down, and that's about 1500 now.

Okay, so it's only 1500. Okay. Yeah. And then the mortgage, just so I know, what is it?

It's about 1900 a month.

Yeah, but how much is it? The total?

Total is about 200,000.

200,000?

Okay. Like John said, you guys need to get married.

You're playing house, just do it.

And this is not, like, for religious reasons. This is for you to protect yourself legally, because if it hits the fan, this is going to be so messy and so crazy that you're protecting yourself by making sure that this is all legally wrapped up in a marriage. Does he have any debt? He does not. He does not. Okay, so until you get married, but you're getting married this weekend, we're going to list these debts. I'm laughing, but I'm being serious. Like, get yourself the certificate, go online and do the certificate, and then you guys plan a party for later and have champagne and have it fun. But for now, let's get this legal stuff locked up. Is there any reason that he would not want to do that?

So when we graduated college, we sat down and we had a conversation, and it really came down to, what do we want to do first? And I'll be honest, we both agreed that we would rather go with the.

House first because of because we wanted to live somewhere.

So our landlord actually told us about 30 days before our lease was ending that he was no longer going to be renting and he was selling the house. So we didn't have much time to.

Really find a place to live.

So that's when we started looking for houses, and we lived with his parents for a few months.

So you solved a 30 day with a 30 year commitment.

Yes.

And that still doesn't really answer my question. My question was if you said, hey, I want to get married this weekend, so we're protecting both of our butts in this marriage, is there any reason that he would not want to do that? That was my question.

I don't think so. I think it's more of just the traditional essence of tradition.

You all don't care about traditions.

Tradition is gone. You all got borrowed money on a dishwasher. You all have thrown tradition out the window.

But I guess what I'm trying to get at is I want to make sure that he understands that we're not playing house forever. And honestly, legally, you need to be protected and you need to make him understand that, hey, if this goes south, there is no way that this is going to be decided fairly because there's no marriage here. So if you guys break up and you cheat on him or he cheats on you or you just dislike each other, you have a house together, and he can just up and leave and leave you with that debt, or you can just up and leave and leave him with that debt. You know what I'm saying?

There's so much tied up. Here's what makes me scary, here's what makes me scared. We're consciously leaning on the other side of the seesaw because you're on the happy side. Oh, my gosh, look how great. It's awesome, right? We're on the other side. If something goes sideways in your job. If something goes sideways in your relationship and you have sold your car and you're just driving around town in his car, you don't have a home, you don't have a car, you don't have a job. And here's what's important about that. You know that risk, and I'm going to believe you. That risk is very, very small. But do you know what doesn't know that risk profile? Your Amygdala. The part of your brain that is designed to keep you safe all the time. It knows one tiny misstep and you are homeless, carless unsafe without groceries. And your body would be failing you if it let you sleep all night. In this current situation, your body would be failing you if it let you have deep, connected, intimate moments with your boyfriend because it's trying to not die. And so when we talk about like, dude, go do this now, your whole body goes, whoo.

And if that thought of getting everything lined up so that you could feel safe, if that makes you feel more anxious and more scared, then you all go see a premarriage counselor tomorrow, because you all need to deal with that reality. You see what I'm saying, right?

Yeah.

And so it's us loving you, because we just see the other side of this thing going sideways.

And no one plans for that, by the way.

Nobody plans for that. And I wouldn't wish that on you for what?

Not at all.

I want this to work out perfectly, and I want it happily ever after and all that stuff. But whoo, man, you're exposed, exposed, exposed, exposed.

But to answer your money questions, we've just told you how to handle your anxiety and your relational questions once you get married this weekend, you guys are listing this debt from smallest to largest. And now you're combining and getting after this together, right? With your combined income, combined efforts, your debt now becomes his debt. Both of your paychecks now become our paychecks. Both of your debt becomes our debt. And you guys move through this and you process it together. If you're not going to get married, if you're like, hey, I don't care what you guys say, then you pay this off by yourself. And you need to look into a way of getting one of your names off of that mortgage, all right? And figure out how to do that. Because if you're not going to get married, you don't both need to be on this deed.

Work two jobs, three jobs. Make it happen. Get this debt paid off ASAP. We'll be right back, folks.

Changing your family tree takes more than rice and beans and side hustles. It's also about transferring the big financial risks off your family by having the right kinds of coverage in place. That's why my team created the Coverage Checkup quiz. It only takes about five minutes to find out what types of insurance you need and don't need. To protect your finances. Make this quiz one of your regular checkups, starting right now@ramsaysolutions.com. Slash checkup. That's Ramsaysolutions.com. Slash checkup.

Welcome back to the Ramsey show. Hey, listen, if you are sick and tired of all the financial just the downer financial news, and you're finally waking up to the fact that nobody in Washington's coming to save you, and you listen to this show and you've been listening to this show, and you just think, gosh, I wish everybody would just pull their heads out and start living these principles.

Pull their heads out of where, John?

Any orifice any orifice they have shoved it in, and you think, how do I get this out there? You don't have to spend one penny. All we need you to do is leave a five star review. Click subscribe, put the little thumbs up button. Wherever you're consuming this, please subscribe to it. Push the buttons like it all the things. And it kicks it up into the algorithms. And it puts this in front of hurting people who google can't breathe in so much debt. How do I help my wife feel better about our finances? Then it kicks these videos up because you all have taken just 10 seconds to do this. It doesn't cost any money. And it helps out your neighbors. It helps out us. It helps out you. It helps out everybody. The only way this mess gets solved in this country is from the bottom up, grassroots homes like yours and mine deciding we're unplugging from the matrix and we're going to make different decisions. So thank you so much for your continued support. Let's roll out to Columbia, South Carolina, and talk to the powerful Haley. What's up, Haley?

Hey, John. How are you?

Good. How are you?

I wish I could be better, honestly.

Well, what's up?

I was hoping to get some input on how to best address certain financial behaviors in my family while also financially preparing myself for my future at the same time.

Okay, go for it. Unpack that for us.

Right. So I'm 25. I'm set to graduate with my master's and take board exams to be a clinical informaticist in the next year.

Congratulations.

Thank you. I did have to move home due to COVID and it being my graduate year that year, a lot of job opportunities kind of fell off.

Okay.

I was required to basically time to get myself financially together. Moving home, I realized how awful, really, our finances were. I'm kind of treated like the family bankemergency fund.

Yes.

Anytime any emergency repairs or anything come up, I'm usually the go to person to go and fix it. I've honestly contributed financially to my family for years. The earliest memory would be ten balancing checkbooks, helping to pay light or water, choosing between light and water.

Do you still live at home?

Right now I'm really trying to get myself in a better place as far as getting student loan paid off, which will be done within the next at least three or four years.

Haley. Haley.

Haley. Haley.

Haley. Haley. Haley. Haley. Do you still live at home?

Yes, sir.

Okay. When are you moving out? I need a date.

The target date would be January of 2025.

There's no way.

All board exams are over.

Why?

You got to move that way up.

Yeah.

And you know that, right?

Yes, sir.

Can I ask you why you feel like you need to stay home until that point, or why you felt like you needed to stay home until that point in 2025?

Gosh. I'm sorry. I'm trying not to cry.

No, it's okay. This is heavy stuff. Listen, let me just say this before you answer it. No ten year old should be paying their parents water bill, period. And I'm sorry that you, as a ten year old, had to take that responsibility on. And it's going to be the 25 year old you who's walking across the stage with a graduate degree. I'm so proud of you. It's going to take your 25 year old having a hard conversation, maybe for the first time, and saying, the gravy train stops here. And then you're going to feel guilty beyond all guilt, and they're going to come after you and say all the mean things about you, and they don't get a vote. They've used you long enough. Fair?

Yes, sir.

Okay. So when's your move out date?

Now would be after exams, which would be June of next year.

No.

Let's help you move this up. Let's help you move it up. Are you earning any money right now?

Yes, ma'am.

How much are you earning?

Approximately 30. I'll say 36 a year.

What's that per month? What are you taking home per month?

Taking home per month would at least be 21 to 22.

Okay.

Sorry.

I got you and you've got your student loans, right? How much are those?

I'm currently still in school.

Okay. So they're not due. Great. Any other debt that would hold you back?

No, ma'am. That's it?

No, ma'am. That's it. That's excellent. Okay. Let's start doing some research this weekend. When you get off the call, I want you looking around your area have you done that yet? To see what an apartment would cost, a one bedroom, one bathroom in a part of town that's safe, and that would get you where you need to go as far as school and everything else.

Putting up a note in the grad school office and saying, Roommate needed.

I have. And honestly, I start and then I back out. Because I start to feel guilty.

Yes. And so you've probably heard me say this 100 times, I'm going to say it 10,000 more times before I'm done being on the air. From this point forward, I want you to choose guilt over resentment every time. And here's why. You are choosing to avoid feeling guilty, and in the process, you're coming to hate your family. Fair?

That's fair.

Okay. Let's don't do that to them. Let's don't do that to them. Let's choose to draw boundaries. They're going to keep us safe and keep us whole. And let's choose to separate where it's appropriate. And it's been appropriate for you for a long, long time, because I could almost guarantee you that they don't have their hooks in you. Just financially. But it's emotionally, too, right?

Yes, sir.

Yeah. You're worth being free. And your parents got to learn how to pay their bills. What happens if you disappear? You go get an apartment and you're out. What happens to them?

As far as I know, financially, arguing holes in various places. There's no retirement anymore. I had, at one point, started a college fund. I did not know that was liquidated until just before I was applying to college.

So your parents stole from you.

I don't want to say it like that.

I'm going to. They stole from you?

They did.

They stole from their child. Not okay. I want you to put 60 days on the calendar, and I want you to come up with a plan, even if you have to take some more hours. And I want you after finals this semester. I want you moving out over Christmas, if that's possible.

It's possible.

You're worth being free, my friend. How does that sound?

Honestly? Nerve ragging.

They've probably been telling you for a long time that not only can they not live without you, but that you're nothing without them, right?

Close.

Yeah, you are. You have been doing the hard work of changing an entire family tree, not only by yourself, but in spite of all the people hanging on you're about to find out you are stronger than you ever thought possible. You've grown muscles in places that most of us never have to because we don't have that kind of trauma.

And the muscles aren't to drag them along.

That's right. I want you to go see your college counselor college counseling center. You pay into that fee, and there's some great college counselors out there go sit down and say, I want to make a transition plan. It's time for me to get these chains off my arms and legs and for me to fly on my own. We love you. We're so grateful for you. This is the Ramsey Show, live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions. It's The Ramsey Show, where we help people get out of debt, build wealth, find jobs and purpose that they love and grow incredible relationships. I'm John Deloney, joined by my great friend Jade Warshaw, and we are taking your calls on just about everything. Triple 825225 is triple 825225. Let's run out to New Hampshire. Back to New Hampshire and talk to James. What's up, James? How are we doing, man? Good. You good. What's up, man?

My question is, should I pay off my credit cards or should I finish repairs on my apartment to gain more income.

Your apartment to gain income. You're not living in the apartment, you'renting it out.

So my house is kind of like a duplex, but not really like a duplex. So right now I live in the house, and I have two roommates helping me pay the mortgage.

Okay.

And then it's going to cost me a good chunk to finish it. I've been going through every time I rip open a wall, I find more and more issues.

Yeah. So I'm probably going to stop doing that. Exactly. Okay, so you live in this house. You've got two of your budies living there with you rent free.

Yeah, I'm pretty much rent free right now.

Pretty much, or you are?

Oh, yeah, I am.

Okay, so how much debt do you have? Including the credit cards? Put all of it in there. Tell me all of it.

Just 77 and a half thousand.

Did you say just 77 and a half thousand?

Yeah. Okay, that's credit cards, personal loans, and car loans.

Okay, so let's break it down. What's the personal loan?

I have two. It's just under 20 grand.

Okay. 10,000.

Each one's like eight, the other one's like twelve.

Okay, and then what else? Keep going through the rest of it.

Credit cards, two car loans, 117.

One's like 16, 17,016 thousand.

Why do you have two cars, Homie?

I have three. I have my truck that I bought years ago. I use it to do a bunch of stuff. I drive back and forth from New Hampshire to California for work. Is that one paid my truck? No, that's the one that I owe 17 for.

Okay. Is the third car paid for, or does that one have a note as well?

Yes, it's a 2013 Prius.

Okay. The 2013 Prius is paid for. What's it worth?

Like, probably what I paid for it's. 65 to seven.

No chance. How many miles does it have on it?

169,000.

I bet you can get ten for it, but that's either here. Yeah. Go to Kelly Blue Book. You can get ten for it.

Keep going through the steps.

But the thing is with the free.

Is keep going through the steps. I derailed us. That's my bad. Keep going through the steps.

I owe.

So we did personal loan, one personal loan, two car, one car, two. Keep going. Rolling down there.

I owe like, one credit card is like, seven. Another one a little over two grand.

Okay.

There's another one that's like six or seven.

Okay.

And I think it's one that's.

Off.

The top of head. I think another one's like four.

So how do you feel right now, listing out all that debt?

Yeah, it's not great.

Yeah. What's the house worth, this duplex house? If you were to sell it?

I think, I don't know, like 335 maybe, I hope.

And what would it bring in profit?

I owe two or 13 on right now.

Okay, so not much.

No.

Okay. How old are you?

29. I'll be 30 in February.

When did you buy this house? This duplex?

In December 2019.

December 2019? Yeah. You need to sell this house. You're going about everything in the wrong direction. And apparently it needs, like you said, every time you open up a wall, there's something more that it needs. And you need to sell this house. You need to sell this Prius. And I want you getting in an apartment with those same two roommates, only this time they're paying part of the rent. And I want you to get yourself a clean slate, and let's restart this and let's knock these debts out one by one so that you can breathe. It sounds like you when I look at this, here's what I see. I see a guy who wants to be successful financially, but went about all the wrong ways to actually do it, and it's backfiring. And it's causing you to call two people that you've never met on the radio to get help.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? And I want you to be successful financially, too. Can we both agree that maybe you went down the wrong path?

Yeah, possible. Some things, yes.

All things.

Which things do you think you did right? I'm just curious which things are right for you in this equation?

My job and my truck, probably, because I do make money with my truck and my car.

Okay, so job is good. What kind of job do you have, by the way?

I work for the government. I fix warships.

Oh, cool. And what are you earning doing that this year?

I should hit 98, hopefully 100.

Good. And so the 17,001, that was your work truck, right?

Yes.

Okay. The 16,001, we're selling that. We don't need it, so you can sell that one, and let's keep the Prius. If you can't use your work truck for everyday stuff, let's flip it. But if you can use your work truck for day to day, then let's sell the Prius and car number two. Yeah. So that clears out quite a bit of debt right there already. And then after that, we've got these personal loans. We can just work through those bit by bit by bit. And if you sell this house, it's not going to bring much, but whatever it brings, we're going to put on the smallest debt and we're going to pay that one off. And then whatever is left, we're going to pay the next one off, and we're going to work through this and we're going to pay the stead off. And when it's all said and done, if you do it my way, when it's all said and done, you're going to have no debt. You're going to have three to six months of expenses in cash sitting in the bank, and you're going to be investing 15% of your $98,000 salary every single month.

And you're 29 years old, you're going to look up, all of this is going to be done. Let me look at this right quick. Everything is going to be done in about twelve months. If you hit it and if you do the things that I told you, in a year from now you're going to breathe and you're going to have a clean slate and you're going to have cash and you're going to have investments started, and you're going to go, oh, man, I'm so glad that on October 27 I called John and Jade.

Yeah, I do have 23,000 in the bank, though.

All right, let's use it to pay off this debt. Keep 1000 aside as a starter emergency fund and put the other 22,000 on this debt. And you're going to go in order. You're going to knock out the 4K card tonight, the six K card tonight, the other $2,000 credit card. You're going to work through these credit cards smallest to largest, and then you're selling those cars. And when you look up, you're going to have 812, you're going to have about $27,000 and you're going to blow through that so quickly because you have a $98,000 income and you're single and you're on fire.

And now, my brother, you're going to be free. This is the Ramsay show. We'll be right back.

If you pay taxes to the IRS every quarter or run a small business and you're not using a CPA, what are you doing? The more complicated your tax situation gets, the more you need expert help. With a Ramsey Trusted Tax Pro, you can get top notch service year round for payroll, bookkeeping, quarterly tax payments, and of course, tax filing. Let an expert take the stress off your shoulders. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash tax to find a Ramsey Trusted Tax pro today. That's Ramsaysolutions.com slash tax.

This is The Ramsey Show and we are coming up on the holiday season and many of you are already tripping out a little bit. Just the thought of sitting around the Thanksgiving table with all the cousins and the grandparents and all the screens and all the political opinions and all of that one cousin that can't shut up about COVID And so listen, I got you, I got you questions for Humans this year. We took him one step further and we got the Thanksgiving deck. We have the Christmas deck and we have grandparents and kids. And that was a special request that we got so often that we sat down with some grandparents and some kids and we're going to save your holiday season. All right, so Jade, I pulled a few questions out of the questions for Humans thanksgiving deck. This is designed for people to take to Thanksgiving dinner or lunch or whatever and avoid all the disastrous conversations and drama.

All right, is that possible?

I'm trying. I want to look my kids in the eye and say, hey, your old man got in the. Ring and tried.

Okay, hit me. Hit.

Families all fell apart, but we gave it a shot. All right, so what is one Thanksgiving food item that makes you gag?

Green bean casserole. When it's made the wrong way. What's that mean, the wrong way? I'm going to just say it right now. The folks who are getting a can of green beans and putting cream of mushroom soup on it and then crumbling up those French onions, y'all ought to be ashamed of yourself. It's so nasty.

He's like that's how I do it. That's how I do it.

My mom taught me the right way to make green bean casserole, and I've never seen anybody make it this way.

What is it?

You get the green beans, and you can use canned, like the French cut kind, so they're, like, nice and thin. You saute it with onions. You add some sour cream Swiss cheese into the sauce, pour it in a casserole dish. Then you take cheese crackers. And this is the one time you need to buy Cheez Its from the store. Name brand. Don't come in here with cheese flavored rounds or whatever. You know what I'm saying? Get the real Cheez Its, crumble them up, bake it in the oven. You'll thank me later. Never make that nasty casserole again. That other kind.

All right, look, I like my crispy French's, but I'm going to need that recipe, okay?

Yes.

We're on it.

You got it, Austin.

Austin does not have a discerning. Sure. That's for sure. See what he brings for lunch. All right, so I'm going to preface my question with this. I'll eat anything. I'll eat anything. I'm a big Steve Ronella fan, like the meat eater.

Okay. Okay.

I will eat anything. I won't eat armadillo. And so I've drawn a line there.

Thank you for drawing the line at Armadillo, AJ's.

Like, oh, it's delicious, man. But also when somebody opens up a can of canned cranberries and it keeps the tube of the can, you can see the indentations. I can't wrap my head around how somebody puts that inside their body. Now, Austin, I've seen him, like, rub it on his arms and his face. He's gross. But listen, I just look at it and think, I just want to throw up the thought of that. I just can't wrap my head.

I was going to be quiet cranberries, by the way.

Yeah, I was going to be quiet, but I got to defend myself. I make my cranberry jam from scratch.

Thank you.

There you go.

Thank you.

Scratch that's. None of this canned stuff. All right.

And it's so easy.

All right, so last question. Thanksgiving question. What makes our family weird, and what makes our family the best when it comes to Thanksgiving?

Well, depending on who asks the question, I might say you're the one that makes it weird.

What makes our family weird? You.

What makes our family weird, and what makes us the best? Oh, boy. That's a loaded question, John. I can't answer it on the air. The things that make us great is what we endure together. And the thing that makes us weird is that we still hang out with each other even though all that we've endured together.

Excellent. I will say what makes my family weird is I'm going to answer this as carefully as I can. We have a really dark sense of humor in our house. And almost every time our Thanksgiving meal ends with really inappropriate jokes and my mom storming off and it's become almost a family tradition, like a challenge. And then my dad, I look over in his face or in his hands, and he always says, guys, you all get to go home. I got to deal with this. And my mom is like, I just thought by now we'd be it's. Every year since I was about twelve.

I got to hear some of these jokes.

They're not great. I'm not proud of them, but it just devolves. But I think that's what makes us not the best. But also I think it's what makes us the best. There's just no holds barred. This is going to shock you. I am kind of the quiet, stable one at that table, if that tells you anything about where it goes. I'm shook it's. Awesome. It's fantastic. Questions for humans. Go to Ramsaysolutions.com and rescue yourself and your family this holiday season. Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's, and grandparents and grandkids. Hey. This year, go visit your parents and go on a date and hand your parents these cards and they can deal with the little ones this time without just handing them digital, babysitters. All right, let's run out to Atlanta, Georgia and talk to Skyler. What up, Skylar? Hey.

Need some advice on what my wife and I should do with her car.

What does she want to do?

So what she wants to do so we figured out that it's burning oil and that piston rings are bad, but it's still running fine right now.

Okay.

I'm thinking that we should sell the vehicle now while it's still worth like 6000, $8,000 and get an equal trade or like a $10,000 vehicle. And she's thinking, because I'm a service technician, so I drive a service vehicle most of the time. So we're together in her vehicle 95% of the time. She's thinking, sell my truck and sell her car and get a nicer car.

Then what would you do for your service vehicle?

Well, I mean, the service vehicle, I would drive it for work. And then whenever we're not in work or whenever I'm not at work, we pretty much be together most of the time. I don't want to sell my personal vehicle. I mean, it's paid off. When, baby? Step three.

B. Oh, so there's three. There's your car, your wife's car, and your service vehicle.

Yes.

Got you.

What about option three, which is spend a couple of get this thing fixed.

Well, the piston rings are bad on it and it's pretty much like it's valued at about $6,000 and you pretty much just might as well put a new engine in it and that's going.

To be almost the same value, almost total. So as a service technician, here's my gut response. I'm going to scrape together $10,000 for me and my family and I'm going to walk in and I'm going to buy this car that you know is bad. That part makes me feel uncomfortable. It feels unethical to me that you as a guy who can see this thing coming are like, I'm offloading this sucker right now and some other sucker family is going to have to deal with it.

Yeah.

No, I totally know. We just see it coming. You know what I mean?

No, I see it coming.

I don't know what to do.

I see it coming, but it feels like a.

I don't know, John. I feel like if he sells it to a dealer, they're going to do whatever they have to do to get.

It driver mean, if he sells it to a dealer and lets them know, hey, this thing's bad in here. I can see that.

Or if he's doing private sale and you're looking up the value with the issues, then you're disclosing.

Hey, this is going to need a new engine, so we're going to sell it at $4,000 instead of ten.

I think as long as you're you.

And I took a call earlier where somebody put a pretty sheen on some foundation issues on a house. Right. And now this family is stuck and they are trapped inside this house because they can't afford to get out and they can't afford to stay. That's right. And so as a guy who doesn't know much about cars, it makes me uncomfortable. It feels like one of those not by your hand but in your lap situations, which is, I hate this for you and it stinks. And there's an ethical way out of this. And then there's a I guess as long as you tell the truth.

Yeah, tell the truth. Sell it, put some cash with it and get her another car of equal value. Or if you can afford to put a little more cash with it, that.

Might be the best thing to do.

Just be honest. Honesty is the best policy.

Yeah. This is the Ramsey show. We'll be right back.

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This is the Ramsey show. Let's go out to Houston, Texas, and talk to Amy. What's up, Amy?

Hi. My question for Y'all is my husband and I are wanting to downsize, but my mom lives with us here, so we're not sure what to do.

Why does she live with you?

We have two kids under the age of two, and initially when I got pregnant, she retired, so it kind of was like a great it was going to work out where she kind of helped me out. But she also has her own business that she's trying to get off the ground and stuff. But I guess if you asked us today, we don't know why we all still live together.

Well, it worked out when she could offer the childcare. Now, how old are your kids now?

One is two, and the other one is eight months. Okay. Yeah. And so she does contribute. She does help out a little bit. But we are currently on baby step one, starting over again. Before we had kids, we were at a better spot. We were at baby step two, but now we're back down to baby step one, trying to get back to our emergency savings.

What happened?

I think just bills got higher, and we live in a house. We moved from an apartment. We were all in a two bedroom apartment, and my husband and I and the baby were in one room, and my mom was in another. And then she retired. Well, she had retired before moving with us, and then she moved in. And then we got an offer to move into a house a little bit under the market rate through a friend, and so we moved into that house. But now it seems like we're house poor for somebody else's home. Just everything to keep up with in a home, from the lawn to the gas bill.

And your mom's not paying anything to live with you guys?

Well, she is paying to live with us, but we ran the numbers, and if we moved to, like, a one bedroom to be gazelle intense with our kids, we would be saving almost $600 a month opposed to what she contributes. The difference is really $50 of us living in an apartment being gazelle intense or her living with us. It's really not.

I'm going to suggest that you guys don't move into a one bedroom apartment with two little kids.

Me too.

Okay.

That's what we would call napkin math. That works on a napkin. It does not work in reality.

Y'all are going to go crazy in there.

Now, I know there are people listening to the show or people who have family members that are doing that because they simply have to. So I'm not knocking it. That is not y'all's situation. That is a napkin math problem that y'all did that would accelerate your current situation. What does your husband do for a living?

He's an operations manager. He sprays for pests.

What does he earn?

He earns about 50.

And what do you earn a year?

I'm a stay at home mom, and I do bake on the side.

Okay. How are you a stay at home mom when the whole reason the grandma came to live was so she could help with the kids?

Well, it's not that kind of help. It's kind of like when she's around, can assist because she has her own things kind of going on.

What did you do for work before you were a stay at home mom?

I cooked a restaurant. Okay.

I need you to go back to work.

Okay.

In some capacity, we're going to figure that out. There's going to be a way that you're going to work quarter time, work part time, or work nights or work weekends, but you need money coming into the house. Because if $600 a month is making or breaking and causing you guys to think that maybe we'll move into a one bedroom apartment with four of us, there's other ways to get that $600 back in your pocket. And it's called your Saturday and Sunday.

Or your husband's going to spray all day, and then he's going to go work the 08:00 P.m. To 11:00 P.m. Shift or 08:00 P.m. To midnight shift after dinner with the kids.

Yeah. He just interviewed to deliver pizzas. Okay, good. And I bake on the side and stuff.

Baking on the side, that's not going to bring the money you need.

Yeah, you can do that while the kids are awake. I'm talking about things to do to make even more money when your husband's home, like at night and also on the weekends or when Grandma's home. And by the way, if Grandma's still going to live there, this is when you cash that chip in, and you're like, Grandma, I need to go work because we're in debt.

Yeah. We're struggling. And we're going to do one of two things. We're going to sell this house and go to a two bedroom apartment, and you're going to find a place here's the three things we need to raise rent because we're trying to find a $600 spread. My husband can take a second job. I need to work a little bit. And we're going to have to raise a rent a little bit on you if we're going to all keep this house. And I'm going to need some help from 06:00 A.m. Until 10:00 A.m. Because I got to go back to work because we got to get this debt down.

How much debt is it, by the way?

We have $42,000 altogether. A car and student loan.

Okay. How much is the student loan and how much is the car?

The student loans is 30 and the car is twelve.

Okay. So the car is okay. Student loans, 30. All right. Yeah. Right now, you bringing in an income changes everything, because if you've proven that you guys can live a life on $50,000, then if you got another income, if you found a way to earn $40,000 a year, it would change your entire life and you'd be out of debt in a year. Do you see how I did that?

Yeah.

And even if that means you having a hard conversation with your mom and saying, mom, I know you've got your thing on the side, we're going to have to do one of two things because the numbers aren't working out. We're going to need some help here because I got to go back to work or we have to sell the house. We're going to move to a two.

Bedroom apartment, and we don't own the house.

We'renting the house the house you're in right now?

Yeah, the house we're in right now is a house we'renting how much are you paying?

I got you. How much are you paying per month?

Currently 15. It's supposed to go up to 1750. So that's why we're what is she paying? Well, we had started decreasing her rent because we thought she was going to leave. She said it was planned that she would leave in November, but things changed. So currently she pays 350.

Yeah. That's not enough.

Yeah, it sounds like you so all in all, the rent is 1850 and she's just paying 350 of it?

Well, the rent currently is 15 and she was paying 550, and then it gradually went down as she was getting ready to exit, but now it seems.

Like I'm not mad at that. She's paying a third, and I don't think you're going to find anything cheaper than this, honestly. Did you look at two bedroom apartments before you looked at one bedroom apartments?

1500 is 500 a month. That's the number I had in my head.

For a one bedroom?

No, for this house.

Yeah. For the mom, you're saying? Yeah, I think that's fair.

500 is fair.

Yeah, I think that's fair. My question, I guess, was, is there a two bedroom? I feel like when I look at this, I'm like, that's a pretty good price to rent a house that is housing all of you. I don't know that you can find anything cheaper. You know what I'm saying? I don't think that you should get rid of this house. This rental situation.

The cheapest thing I found was a one bedroom with a study.

Yeah, no, that's not going to work.

Here's a bigger question. Do you want your mom out? Be honest.

I'm the only child, so it's really hard to say that because no, you.

Feel guilty and you love your mom. Just because you wanted to move out doesn't I love my mom to the moon and back, and I don't live with my mom. Right. Both of those things can be true.

So essentially yes, because I want to live the life of my husband and my children.

Of course you do. Of course you do.

It's time to have that conversation.

Hey, that's not wrong or bad.

Not a bad thing.

That's so normal. And so normal that you want to live your life in your house with just your husband and your kid. There's nothing wrong with that girl.

Okay, so on the financial, I guess.

You got to start working. If you can find 30 and he can find another ten, you're out of debt in one year. Twelve months. That's a drop in the bucket and.

It'S going to be awful. And do it anyway.

It's not going to be that bad. They've been living on 50,000 as it is.

That's right. Yeah. It's choosing your heart, right? Yeah.

You guys got this. You're going to have to make some sacrifices and some real choices, but you can do it.

Today's scripture of the of the day is Isaiah 40 31. But those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles. They will run and not grow weary. They will walk and not be faint. The great Lars Ulrich, founding member and drummer extraordinaire of Metallica, says, stretching your parameters is a necessity if you want to keep growing. I like it.

Hey, when you hear Isaiah 40 31, does it make you think of remember the Titans?

Always light giggle. You remember that? Love it. Anyway, all right, let's go out to Birmingham, Alabama and talk to Philip. What's up, Philip?

How's it going?

We're rocking on to the Breaking Dawn, brother. What's up?

Hi, man.

I just had a quick question. Well, one thing to start off, my wife and I started doing the snowball two months ago. We've already paid off $35,000 in debt.

Whoa. Did you sell something?

Well, I'm in sales, and so I had a big motivator to make some extra money and I had my biggest month ever and was able to pay off a lot of debt really quickly.

Congratulations, man. That's fantastic. What's up? Yeah.

All right, so question. My grandmother is being taken advantage of financially by my aunt. I'm wondering how I can step in and help.

How have you already tried?

I haven't tried yet.

Okay.

I haven't said anything to anybody. And the situation I'm about to share, I'm not even supposed to know, but my mom told me because it's like an emergency situation. So I'll give you some context. So, on the back end, my grandmother, she struggles financially. Didn't invest in retirement, didn't know who Dave Ramsay was ever until I started going into him a while back. So unfortunately, she wasn't set up. Now she's in her 70s, has no retirement, and she just draws Social Security. And I think she brings in like, 1400 a month. So.

She'S okay. She's not like very thin.

Very thin. Yeah. No margin there. So she came to me two or three years ago about how does she get some breathing room, and so I essentially bought her house for what was owed on it and put some money into it to fix it up. And she lives there for free. She just pays utilities. And that was kind of a retirement thing she and I worked out. So that gave her a little bit of margin.

But your name is on the house, you own it, correct.

Okay, correct. Anyway, so she's been fine for two or three years. Like, not rich, but she's doing good. Well, my aunt, who is her daughter, is very bad with money. Very bad with money. And almost weekly, it seems like, is asking my grandmother for money. Nothing big. It's usually $40 here, $50 there. But that stuff adds up, especially when it's coming from somebody with no margin. So, anyways, it's always bothered me. I hadn't said anything. It's my grandmother's money, whatever. But recently, last week, I got a call from my mom. My grandmother ended up paying a bill, utility bill or something for my aunt, and my aunt apparently took a picture of her debit card and ended up using it for other things as well, without telling my grandmother.

Wow.

Yeah. And last month, my grandmother is at Walmart checking out, getting groceries, and car gets declined, which is one, embarrassing, but two, it's one of those. You're like, oh, my God, I know I have money in there. It's not there. What's going on?

That's straight up illegal.

Yeah.

It's stealing.

Yeah. So she goes and checks, and apparently about $500 has been spent without permission from my grandmother's card on an online game that my aunt has been playing. And so anyways, grandmother confronts the aunt, and the aunt goes, oh, I don't know how that happened. That's crazy. I'll try to get your money back, that whole thing. And that's kind of where we're at. And I'm not supposed to know about this because my grandmother knows how I'm going to react.

Well, here's the deal. So this is one of those situations not by your hand, but in your lap. You didn't ask for this situation. You didn't ask for somebody in your family to be so deceitful as to steal from an elderly mother.

Wow.

And quite honestly and quite frankly, you didn't ask for your mom to not get involved with her mother and her sister, which is her responsibility. As you started talking, my first question to you was going to be, call your mom, or why haven't you called your mom? And your mom has passed the buck to you. And so if I'm you, I would tell my mom, mom, you have 24 hours to get involved, and then I'm going to get involved. You've given me this information, and I can't sleep at night. I'm the homeowner. I've already bailed this whole family out of problem one, and I'm about to go get involved again, too. And by the way, I'm going to call the police. I was about to say, Mom's going to get her debit card changed. She needs to do that before the day is over.

She did that already.

Okay, good.

But are you calling the PopOS? Because that's what I'm doing.

I'm calling the police. At the very minimum, I'm making it very clear to my aunt, because nobody else in the family will. If you come near Grandmother again and ask for money, I call the police. Because you stole this. Right. And I understand that this is awkward and weird. Unfortunately, your mom puts you in a very awkward, weird situation. Unfortunately, your family has not been as responsible with money as you have been, and they have put you in multiple awkward, weird positions. And if people keep doing that to me, I'm going to take the straightest path out. And by the way, Grandmother can do what Grandmother wants to do, as much as that pains me to say. So if she says, I want you to butt out, you are not calling the police. Get away from me. That's going to hurt. It's going to hurt like all bloody hell. And she gets to do that because she's a grown up and it's her money. Yeah, right. Why did your mom not make a whole bunch of calls and ring all the bells? If I found out my little brother stealing from my mom, oh, it's going down.

Oh, my gosh. You would never a million years do that. He's such a person. High integrity. Why didn't your mom get on the phone with her sister immediately?

Well, she said something to her. Sorry. She wanted to say something. But my grandmother goes, hey, I'm telling you this. I shouldn't have told you. Don't say anything to your sister. Don't say anything to anybody.

Well, then don't tell.

My mom calls me. I'm the responsible one in the family. When I speak, people in the family listen because they're like, he means what he says, he says what he means. All that stuff.

Good for you for breaking this family curse. I would tell my mom, you've got 24 hours to get right in the middle of this, because I'm going to. And she'll say, oh, Philip, don't do that, please. Grandmother told me in confidence, grandmother wants someone to help or she wouldn't have said anything.

That's what I'm thinking.

And she's thinking, I told my daughter and nobody's helping.

Well, she's hoping there's a way this could be done where no one's feelings get hurt and no one has to know about it and that you can just sweep it under the rug, but it's just not possible at this point.

Yeah.

I'd put everybody on notice. And here's the other thing. You're sending a message, one of two messages. Number one, if you don't want me involved, you better not tell me, because I'm getting involved. Number two, I don't play this game. We treat each other with dignity and respect. We don't steal from family members. We don't steal from our elderly mothers.

Wow.

We don't commit fraud in our own house. I won't stand for that. And there we go. At the end of the day. Also, this might even be a little bit weirder. That's your home. You can tell your aunt you are not welcome in my home. Right. Yeah, you could tell your aunt I'll no trespass. You on my property because Grandmother's a tenant of my place, but not welcome. Oh, it was an accident.

I didn't mean it wasn't an accident.

It's not an accident. She got caught. Yeah, she's trying to make some money on an online game. And wouldn't you know it, she didn't win. Man golly. Hey, I'm glad it's you, Philip, because you're a person of high integrity and high just just for a moment like this. Hey, I want to thank all the guys in the booth. And, Skylar. Thank you, America, for tuning in and listening to the show. Great job, Jade. Hey, be kind to one another. Pay off your debts. Don't steal from your mother. We'll see you soon. Right here on the Ramsey show.

Hey, guys, I'm Rachel.

And I'm George.

And you've probably heard our voices before on The Ramsey Show.

And do we have a surprise for you.

Yep. We have our very own show, smart Money Happy Hour, where we talk about pop culture, current events, and, of course, money. George it's a great show. And what else do we talk about?

So much, Rachel. Not enough. And yet too much. We talk about guilt tipping, because tipping is out of control, and I won't stand for it anymore, which is why I'm sitting.

I'm glad you're taking such a stand.

And we also talk about something else I'm passionate about disney adults. Why is it a thing?

Listen, some adults still find the magic.

Sure. We also talk about toxic money traits and girl math. And if you don't know what those are, you have to listen to the podcast.

Yeah, there's a lot there, you guys, it's pretty fun.

We keep you relevant, is what I'm trying to say.

We help you out.

So pull up a chair to the happy hour you wish your friends were having. We promise you won't regret it. And if you don't have friends, we'll be your friends.

We will. We're great friends.

So make sure to check it out.

On Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or the Ramsey Network app.