Welcome to the Tucker Carlson show. We bring you stories that have not been showcased anywhere else. And they're not censored, of course, because we're not gatekeepers. We are honest brokers here to tell you what we think you need to know and do it honestly. Check out all of our content@tuckercarlson.com. Here's the episode. We've never done anything in here before. This is actually our dining room table, as you know. You had dinner here last night.

Yeah. And you cleared a bunch of stuff out, though, right?

We just moved the chairs out, but we actually, I mean, this is our family dining room, so. And I just thought, I don't want to be in a studio anymore.

Yeah, studio is right there.

Studio's right there. It's, like, tiny. And there's something. I've been in it my whole life. All right, let me just. I just gotta ask you about this. This is like, thank you for dinner last night, by the way.

Thank you.

That was amazing.

That was really special.

I don't know how you got home. It was like. That was pretty fun.

Not. All right. Lexi got me right.

Oh, you're wandering around in a t shirt in the freezing cold. Okay. This is just. I just. Okay. So I asked him to pull a bunch of news stories. I've been a little bit out of it. This is from the Guardian. Scientists have created a vaccine that has the potential to protect against a broad range of coronaviruses, including varieties not yet known about. The experimental shot, which has been tested in mice. So it's a vaccine that doesn't protect you against anything specific, but just against kind of like everything that might happen to you, supposedly.

Yeah.

Just leaving the science aside, but as a pure kind of a marketing question, if you're. And I'm going to see who. Who makes this, I guess they're all the same, but some company makes this. If you're the company making this, do you really think people are going to be up at this point for a vaccine that just has no real purpose, but just like, kind of for the sake of a vaccine? Because today.

Yeah, today, no, I don't think so.

Do you think a single person will buy that?

Yeah, for sure. There'll be some people. There's just so much fear still. I mean, people. Yeah, people are scared still. I think there's a swath of population. There's still people driving around in masks.

Yeah, no, that's true. And I'm. I try not to be judgmental because I think, of course, I'm very judgmental. I think they're mentally ill. But then I feel, you know, I've known a lot, I've had friends, family members mentally ill. So I try to think, you know, I should feel compassion for them.

I have a lot more compassion for them, actually, and empathy. And I've been strong against VaX, against mandates, against lockdowns, against all of it. I think the last few months I've been looking at things a little bit differently and I think it's time for a lot of us to maybe adjust some of the approach that we're doing. I mean, it obviously hasn't worked. We've been trying to wake people up. I think with the studies that are out there now, exactly, with the science all the time, with the articles, with the change in stances by everybody from Chris Cuomo on down who have either had vaccine injuries or side effects or just look at things differently. And it's caused me to, I think, have a little bit more empathy and compassion for those people who had ton of fear, thought they were doing the right thing for themselves, for their friends, for their families, and went through all the mass formation psychosis that we all did. This is full court propaganda against us and are now going, oh shit, maybe, maybe that wasn't the best. Maybe they lied to us, maybe they weren't being truthful, maybe this wasn't safe, even though they said from the beginning, 100% safe and effective, everybody from Biden to the head of the FDA and CDC on down, who.

So I think it's important for us to, if we want to make a difference, which I do, and I don't necessarily want to be way a part of the conversation anymore, is how do we call people forward to like, with compassion and kindness that just come over to the, to the side of being awake to what's going on. Because I think we all need to come to the grips that this could happen again.

Well, I think people are, you know, most people took the vax, obviously. And what would that feel like if you had that in your body? I mean, it's like the horror movie. It's coming from inside the house.

Yeah.

I mean, if you had taken the vax, how would you feel right now? You'd be worried?

I would be worried for sure. And then if I was so staunchly for it, and now I'm realizing, oh, I might have endangered myself, my loved ones, my kids. If you force it upon kids like they did, the powers that be pushed it towards all different ages. The studies just came out about pregnant women where 44% of the women in the study had miscarriages who were given the vaccine. It's like there's a lot of crazy research that's out right now that would make people feel a lot of shame, I think, and guilt. And I grew up kind of in that culture in a different way of where.

So now you're on it. It's shame and guilt.

Yeah. That was a part of everyday life was those two feelings, and that's a tough way to live. So how do we call these people forward to, like, in love and acceptance, not forgetting what happened, how we were treated, how we were canceled, how we, I mean, everybody from yourself to me, the Joe, to mutual friends that we have, but, like, calling people forward to, like, step into the truth and that there isn't shame and guilt on this side, which I think our side, you know, justifiably at times because of the way we're treated, feels like we need to kind of get some, get back.

I totally agree with you, but at.

Some point, I was talking with Joe about this kind of off camera at Rogan, but, like, how do we kind of bring everybody back on the same side? Because this has been very divisive, and everything in our culture now is so divisive. Yes, but how do we get people more aligned on the same page? And I think it's only with love and compassion, forgiveness, and, you know, I admit I've been very combative about this because I was attacked personally. A lot of times when you're attacked, you want to just fucking fight back.

I happen to.

I agree, of course, but it hasn't really accomplished what I wanted to accomplish. Like, I'm, in my mind, my ego was like, well, I'm going to be able to convince these people that they were wrong.

You know, when you throw the science back at them and you think somehow that's gonna matter, like, people who talk about science all day actually care about science. Not at all. Of course, that has no effect.

How, I mean, how has it been for you? You know? Cause you were one of the first to talk about it all the time on Fox. And actually that's what made me tune in every night, was like, what's tucking this thing?

They didn't want me to do that.

But, like, there was obviously some cancelation, some shaming, you know, I'm sure that may not have been why they let you go, but it wasn't. There was a lot of people who.

It was a sign of disobedience. And by the way, I didn't want to be disobedient. Actually. I didn't want to fight about the facts at all. I never.

But you had all the. All the people that end up going on Rogan. You had Robert Malone on there. You had Andrew Kersh, you had Pierre Courier, you had Peter McCullough. Right. I mean, all these people in the.

Beginning, right away, because I just had.

A doctor from Stanford as well.

Of course, I had a different understanding of science, which was that it's not a set of facts. It's a process. It's a way of thinking.

Yeah. And that it needs to be questioned.

That's the whole point.

Otherwise, it's propaganda.

It's an unending series of questions. We think we know this. How do we know it's not so different from what journalism used to be, which is like a process of. It's a process. It's a way of thinking. It's skepticism. Polite, reasonable skepticism. It's rooted in reason, though, in the belief that we can get to the truth or closer to the truth using logic. And that was just abandoned immediately. That was the tell for me. I know nothing about vaccines. I still don't really know much about vaccines, but I know a lot about people. And I saw people saying things like, just shut up and do it because it's science. And then I thought, well, that's the opposite of science. And I also got a very sinister vibe right away, just on my gut level, I was like, I don't know what this is. I'm not doing that, and neither is my family. But the weird thing is, that's why I so appreciate what you just said, is I don't really know that many people who got vaxxed. I don't live in a vaxed world at all. My kind of people, given where I live and the people I like and how I spend my free time, like, they're not the people who got the vax.

So I don't spend really any time with people who would defend that. And I think I need to think much more about it and realize, like, all of us live in our own tiny little worlds, and we think we're mainstream, but we're not. And.

And through the algorithm, we're in an echo chamber, whether we want to be or not. Cause that's what we're seeing.

No, it's totally right. Someone said to me the other day, maybe it was you. Do you know anyone who didn't get the vax who's upset he didn't get the vax?

Yeah.

Does anyone regret that decision?

No.

No. Right. Not one person ever. But people who did get the vax, really, which is why I love what you said. I think they do regret it, and I think that when you're doing something wrong, you're very defensive about it. I used to smoke cigarettes, and they tried to make me feel shame for smoking cigarettes. And I would always, like, smoke a cigarette in public. Like, yeah, I'm smoking a cigarette. Cause I sort of knew you're not. You shouldn't smoke cigarettes. It's not good for you. But I got my hackles up, and I was more aggressive. Would you like a cigarette? Would your child like a cigarette? I mean, I sort of wound up being that way because I knew what I was doing was wrong.

Yeah.

And don't you feel like that's part of what's going on here?

I think there's a. There's a big swat that's like that. There's the other swath that goes, I did this because you told me to do this, and this was mandated, and now you're walking back. All those things you said to me back then, now there's some anger, so there's the whole population that's like, I'm gonna keep doing this, and I'm gonna wear my mask in public, and I'm gonna get another booster in your fucking face. Right? And then there's the other group that's like, I know I did this to keep my job, to, like, keep from being canceled, to keep you off my back. And now you're going to walk back and say, you didn't say it was safe and effective, and you didn't say I wouldn't get or I wouldn't acquire or transmit. COVID, like, you're. What do you mean? You're. Now you're changing history. That's the only reason I got it. You said this is the only way to be safe, and there was no side effects, and that was all. That's not bullshit. That was all stuff that was said. And there's videos out there you can check out. So there's. There's that side of the population.

It's like, hold up. Hold the fuck on. Like, you said, all this stuff. Now you're walking us back. That's how I feel, you know? And then there's the other set that. That doesn't want to engage at all that did it, and now has a lot of fear around it, a lot of shame around it. And so I think two of those three groups of people we can kind of, like, bring in, you know, there's compassion and kindness. There's compassion, kindness for the person that's still wearing a mask, too, especially that person. I can't relate to that type of fear, but I understand what it's like to be scared of things and just the fear to feel like you still have to do that, that's a really shitty place to live. So, like, showing compassion and kindness, and it's easy to make fun of those type of people when you're on the way other side. But, like, what does that actually accomplish if we want to come together more? And, look, I'm guilty of it at times, for sure, but, like, I'm tired of that. I don't want to be a part of that anymore. I want to be a part of bringing people together.

I so strongly agree with that. When was the last time you saw a national leader try and calm people down about anything ever? No, I would love it if somebody in elected office or with a lot of influence nationally were to stand up and say, let's start with what we know. We're all going to die, probably terrified and alone. We know we're going there. So in light of that, why are we afraid of anything, actually, given that our fates are all sealed? Like, doesn't that liberate us?

I think so, and I think that's a great place to be. You know, like, when you step into this, you personally, I'm talking about you. When you stepped into this. This realm, you know, you were the number one anchor at number one show nightly, and the stuff you were taking on, and then the way that you were ousted there, and then you go to x and you're the fucking, the interviews you're doing, the numbers you're going, then you go and interview Putin. Like, you're putting yourself in harm's way. You know, like, and I commend you just like I commend Bobby Kennedy because there's, there's, Bobby said recently, there's a lot worse things than dying, that's for sure. And I commend you as I commend Bobby. Like, there's something to standing up for what you believe in and doing your job. You're doing old school, I hate to say it, but old school journalism where you just unfortunately, like. But, but when you go into that, that it's just to piggyback off what you just said. Like, I don't know this person personally, but I know that you must have a relationship with death where you realize that it's inevitable.

And, you know, I'd rather, like, live the way I want to live, stand for what I believe in than, like, live in a fear that something could happen to me.

I'd rather be a free man in my grave. So, of course, yeah. And by the way, I have the massive advantage of having grown children. So when you have little kids at home, and I haven't had a very adventurous or dangerous life, but a couple times, one time in particular, I was pretty sure I was going to die. And I had little kids at home, and I was in a plane crash. And I remember as it was going down, I was like, oh, my gosh, they're not going to thrive if I die. I mean, that really terrified me. But now that they're grown, it's like, I am going to die. So this we know, and I meditate on that a lot. I don't think it's morbid. I think it's liberating. And so then you realize, like, what are you gonna do to me? You know, I'm not afraid at all. And I mean that you may have come to the obvious conclusion that the real debate is not between Republican and Democrat, or socialist and capitalist. Right, left. The real battle is between people who are lying on purpose and people who are trying to tell you the truth.

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Publicsquare.com we are honored. We are proud to have them as a sponsor of this show. So I the people who got the vax and don't want to talk about it because they feel shame. I get it. The people who went along with it because they really believed it and now are starting to realize, oh, gosh, I was misled, but I can't admit that because it makes me look like an asshole, weak, like a follower. I understand that, too. The people who called for the death of the unvaccinated, that's kind of the category that's harder for me. People like Jimmy Kimmel, for example, who famously said Sean Penn as well, and Sean Penn as well, who I know actually, and sort of like. But what? I like him less after hearing that. What? How do you treat people like that who wanted you to die? Doctor Fauci said that if hospitals get any more overcrowded, they're going to have to make some very tough choices about who gets an ICU bed. That choice doesn't seem so tough to me. Vaccinated person having a heart attack. Yes, come right on in, we'll take care of you. Unvaccinated guy who gobbled horse goo.

Rest in peace, wheezy.

You're. Well, I think you framed that in the right, in the right place. Like there's, you know, there was a great mashup that Rogan talked about a few times where there was all these different shows and it said, brought to you by Pfizer. Anderson Cooper, brought to you by Pfizer.

It's an amazing, I think you have.

To realize that there's, it's all about the money. And as you get into this, you read Bobby's book about the Rue Anthony Fauci, you realize if you want to know what's really going on, not just in big pharma but in government, is follow the money. And even in the NFL, I mean, there was a strong push. They sent stooges out to every team to try and enforce a vaccination level above 90% on every team with zero exemption, with zero informed consent. Just get this so that we look good because Big Pharma ad spend is humongous, not just on the late night shows. It's obviously influences Hollywood, the NFL. So you have to understand who is.

Actually, I was talking to a Navy seal friend of mine the other day who just got out of the Navy. And like professional athletes, I mean, these are the last people who needed the vax. And so there was this intense push to make them all get the vax. He left the navy over it, but he said most of his friends on the SEAL team he was on did not get the vax. They got fake vax cards because they knew they're very in touch with their physical health. Their seals not so different from an NFL player. How many NFL players actually got the vax? Do you have any idea?

I don't have any idea. I know that. I'm sure that there was plenty who got fake cards. I feel like, you know, there's. I think there's a base level of hesitancy around just big pharma. Madison, in general, when you're black, well.

I was saying it's like 70% black. To their great credit, a lot of black guys are like, no way.

Yeah. And based on the history, I think it's warranted any of the history about some totally fair human experiments that went on and ridiculous things in some of those communities. If you know about, you know, what's gone on in foreign countries as well with some of these vaccines, predominantly places like Africa.

Oh, yeah.

Where people have been maimed and killed and paralyzed by these vaccines, many of which are not actually approved anymore in the states, get sent over to Africa. Again, that's a reference to something that, Bob, you talked about in this book about Fauci. There's a lot of interesting chapters around that. So on a base level, there was a lot of hesitancy. Like, I don't think this is. I want to do this, but in the NFL, it was like, if you're working for a team, there was no choice. It was. It was get faxed. If you're a player, there was a choice, but if you chose not to get it, then you had a whole different set of rules. You had to wear a different colored armband. You had to, you couldn't go to a restaurant. You couldn't spend time at somebody's house, and more than three people were there. You couldn't go anywhere on the road. You. You had to test every single morning and not enter the building until you got a negative back. That all went away once the playoffs happened because, of course, they didn't want to ruin the money at that point, and all the testing went away.

Oh, there was a playoff exemption for the disease.

Yeah.

I got asked if they're making you wear a colored piece of clothing. Since all of us grew up in the United States, where World War Two is the kind of only historical event, we learn about forcing a small, despised minority to identify itself with the yellow piece of clothing, it seems kind of resonant. Did anyone at the NFL say, maybe not a good idea to force people to wear yellow armbands if they weren't faxed.

I don't think they cared. I think they just wanted to hit. Hit their numbers.

So we look like nazis, but we don't care?

Yeah, I mean, when the stooge came and talked to us, I asked a lot of questions about, like, informed consent, about testing, about liability, and he basically didn't answer any of my questions. The president of the team ended the meeting. And I tell you, a ton of people from every level of the building came up afterwards and thanked me for asking the questions. Cause many of them had no choice. Just get faxed or lose your job. And there are certain coaches around the league who quit because they don't wanna get vaxxed. I'm sure there may have been fake cards that went around.

I hope so.

And we also know there was many batches that were super toxic and deadly, and many batches that were perhaps saline and didn't cause any adverse effects. But the interesting thing around vaccines.

Can I ask you to pause? Do you think that the drug makers knew that they were giving out saline vaccines?

I mean, that's a pure conjecture. I think there's. I have read things about the amount of vaccines that went out, wouldn't have been possible to produce that to that level. So there may have been some knowledge around that, but again, that's just conjecture. And I don't have any specific evidence on that. I'm not an expert at that, but I am an expert at my body and what goes in it and how I feel about that. But, yeah, you know, the whole thing has been a real interesting thought experiment in action around, like, what people are willing to put up with, how you can control through fear and how obedient someone will be. Because remember what was going on on all the networks. You had the live death tolls that were ticking up as you watched the tv. You had the live case numbers, you had just the fear mongering. And then anybody that stood up to it was canceled. I mean, all the Twitter files that got released when Elon took over, that show, the collusion between the Alphabet companies that, you know, control a lot of stuff, and the old, you know, people with x, what was going on at Facebook and the censorship, and all these true experts in it, you know, the Robert Holmes, the Peter McCulloughs, the quarries, all these different people who stood up, the Alex Berenson who said, try to just get the message out, were silenced and censored.

I think a person with any level of common sense would, even if they got the vax, would go. That's kind of weird. Why are we silencing all dissenting opinions when in the history of the world have sent. Has a censorship ever been been done by the good guys? You know, the good guys are the ones doing the censorship that actually doesn't happen. What are you scared of? You're scared of people being able to make up their own mind? Yeah. And, you know, you see it on. Bobby just released a video, 30 Minutes video, and about it, about who he is that got censored by Facebook, which is just wild. I mean, they're censoring the election stuff, which we know is presidential candidate, you know, the Cambridge Analytica. If you've watched that documentary about what happened, it is just pretty wild. The world that we live in, where there's the idea of even free speech and what is it is called into a question all the time. I just read an interesting book that was written a few years ago called the coddling of the american mind. And it basically is talking about what's going on at college campuses, which we're seeing now, all this outrage and different things that started post 2016 when Trump got elected, when campuses felt like they needed to create safe spaces.

Because speech is violent. You know, certain types of rhetoric is actually violent. So we're vilifying the opinions now, and we're canceling people based on what they believe. And that's a slippery slope to go down. Whether you cancel somebody who's, you know, super racist or, you know, against an opinion that you believe in, like, none of that actually works. Ignoring the shit you don't want to listen to or be a part of is one thing, but, like, picking and choosing what to censor is a very slippery slope. And you being in the media, you know, how important is to get people on all different sides.

Well, you can't have democracy if people can't say what they think.

But. But democracy in general, I mean, this country was founded as a constitutional republic. Yes. Which empowers the civil liberties.

You know, democracy unless people are not slaves, unless they're free.

But, you know, so, I mean, democracy always falls into fascism and tyranny and ultimately dictatorship, unfortunately.

I'm aware of that, and that's where we're at. Why do you. Oh, I'm aware. Why do you think that is? Why do you think? And a lot of 19th century sort of free minded people in Europe looked over at what was happening in the newly minted United States and said, that's going to become a dictatorship ultimately. Why do you think that happens?

I think there's a lot of reasons. I think entitlement is a big part of our society that has been a cancer for us because people believe that their opinion is more important than somebody else's opinion. It was weaponized against people who chose not to get the vaccine. People would say, freedom isn't more important than my fucking right to live, but I think ultimately it creates too many voices that are all about division. So there's a true democracy where every vote matters, means that all of us are important to the whole. But when democracy spirals out of control and entitlement is the common thread through it, then nobody believes that your opinion matters as much as their opinion. And it goes into a straight, egotistical, narcissistic view, which ultimately leads to some sort of fascism, some sort of tyrannical stuff. And when it's weaponized by the people in control who control the messaging, in the media, control the food supply, control the water supply, you're fighting a losing battle.

It does feel that way, and it feels like both of us grew up in a country that was outwardly focused on its enemies were outside its borders. Right? I mean, I grew up during the cold war. Enemy was the Soviet Union, China. Pick a country we were at odds with. It does seem like all the energy that the federal government musters against its enemies is being mustered against american citizens. Like, we're the enemy. That's the way it feels to me.

Yeah. I was at the Kentucky Derby this last weekend, and they were swearing in some new recruits to, I think, join the army. And so they had them repeat, repeat after the sergeant or whatever who was swearing them in. And I just was stuck with that one line that protect against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

Yes.

I was like. And I said kind of domestic out loud because I was like, are we forgetting that one? Because there's a lot of domestic people in this country who actually don't love America, who actually don't want to see us thrive. I'm super patriotic. I think it's because my grandpa fought in the second world war, was a prisoner of war, and believed in freedom and fought for it, and lost many friends using the air force, who were at Pearl harbor, and flew many bombing missions over to try and liberate the french and polish people there over in Europe, and almost lost his life for it and lost a lot of friends and believed in this country and the freedoms that he was willing to fight and die for. And so that's why I grew up in, and I love this country, and I want to see it thrive. And I think there's a lot of people that don't give a shit about it. And you look at some of the policies. How does it make any sense to have open borders, to have non secure elections, to have the lobbying that we have in Washington where the pharmaceutical companies, the big ag, the big everything controls the policy of the policymakers?

You have people in Congress and the Senate who go right from their duties to these huge, huge, profitable jobs or speaking engagements and pick a, pick a, you know, swath of the economy, whether it's banking or ag or military defense or whatever it is, and everybody's in everybody's pocket. And then you create these bills that have 40 different things in it. And we're spending billions of dollars, Ukraine and billions of dollars to Israel and billions of dollars to these college campuses. There's just a lot of issues right now that seem really un american. And I think there's a lot of red blooded Americans. People are like, how can, you know, how can Trump have such support? Well, people are fed up with it. And he speaks the rhetoric of, like, taking back, you know, making America great again and stuff. My thing is he had four years to do it and didn't drain the swamp. And whether he just got scared because of what he learned when he was in there, I think it's very plausible. But that's why I was interested when Bobby came to me and said, what'd you think about being my running mate?

And I said, are you serious? I said, I'm a fucking football player, but I love this country, and I'd love to be a part of, you know, bringing it back to what she used to be. There's a great.

Did you think about it?

Oh, yeah, I thought about it. I definitely thought about it because I love Bobby, and I just wanted to hear what he had to say about it. There's a great opening scene of one of my favorite shows called Newsroom. Do you ever see the opening scene with Jeff Daniels? Jeff Daniels is a, he's an anchor for a news station, and there's a panel. Yeah, great person. And he gets asked this question, you know, why is America so Star spangled great? You know, what makes America so great? Somebody says, like, democracy. And somebody says, like, freedom. And he's like, you know, he doesn't want to answer the question. He says, you know, the preamble of the constitution is the greatest piece of, you know, written material ever, something like that. And then he goes, no, I'm not gonna let you off like that. You got to give me an answer. And he goes into this, like, three minute monolog about how America is not the greatest country anymore. He talks about the literacy rates and math rates and reading rates, and, you know, we spend more than next 25 on the, you know, on defense spending and.

But at the end he said, but we. America is not the greatest country anymore. But it could be. And he talks about what it used to be. And we used to dream big dreams and build incredible, you know, buildings and great technology and different things. It's like super patriotic. And that starts the whole show out where he gets kind of canceled for this or he gets put on display, like, oh, my God. Like, this guy is willing to tackle some of the big. The big issues in this country and keep it real. And I think that's what that resonated with me because I'm like, yes, what used to make America great. How can we get back to that? And that's why I love people who willing to stand up for what they believe in, like yourself. And the stuff you would talk about on your show was. Was, nobody else is doing that, though.

You know, they're cowards.

They're countdown. Well, yeah, I get it, but we're a country of cowards now. People are not willing to stand up for or stand up to the people that are in charge.

Well, I know many people, and I have such contempt for them. I mean, they're not even good at fascism. That's. That's. I guess my final analysis. Are not even good at this.

What was it for you? You're just like, fuck it. Like, I'm gonna say what I want to say. Were you always like that?

Or was there something that way but.

That to be something where you like, okay, because you talked about JFK, you know, and the CIA.

Well, I. We were talking about this last night at dinner, which was so interesting. I mean, you're a professional athlete. This is not your day job. No, it is my day job. I lived in Washington for 35 years, and I didn't really. I mean, I had lots of opinions, all kinds of opinions, but they were sort of aligned with the political party. And I didn't ever question any of the basic assumptions that I had. People would say, oh, Roosevelt knew that the Japanese were going to attack Oahu in December of 1941. I was like, you must be crazy. Well, it turns out that's true. It was a Senate inquiry into it during the war that suggested that strongly, because it's real. That and a lot of other things. But it took me a long time to even ask those questions. And when I did, I was like. I was. Well, then I had to leave the city. I moved out because I was so shocked by it and so distressed by it. But you were saying that. I mean, the real question is not how would I come to that? I mean, I was marinating in that world my whole life.

Why did it take me so long? Is the real question. But how did you, who are on an athletic track, how did you come to these conclusions? That's the more unusual.

Well, I think it was a number of things. I always wanted to question what I believed because I felt like it could strengthen that. And although that wasn't maybe the thought process, growing up in the church, there was a lot to just believe this and have faith. Don't ever question it. If you question it, that's doubt. And doubt is a sin. But I was like, I don't know. I kind of want to question this so I can have it confirmed.

Can I just point out that on the cross, as he was being tortured to death, Jesus said, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me?

Right?

Jesus said that. So the idea he had some doubt.

Yeah, on the cross. But I got into.

So I think you're allowed to ask questions and have.

Well, yeah, I kind of gave myself that permission when I was younger, but I did a report my sophomore year in high school on JFK, and I was just kind of super fascinated by his charisma and the Kennedy family in general.

Yes.

And then his death and what little I knew about it. And I talked to some people that maybe didn't believe the Warren commission or the official narrative, so I did a report on it. It was more on JFK because I think we had to pick an influential person from history to report on. So I picked JFK. And in high school. In high school and back then with very limited Internet access, I did a lot of research in the library and read a lot of things. Read the Warren commission, a decent amount of it, the Warren report. And I was like, there's some bullshit in here. This doesn't make sense. You tell me this magic bullet from this guy went boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom through them, and then they just happened to find it, you know, in the hospital, a certain spot. I was like, that doesn't sound right. So that kind of got me into questioning things, conspiracies, for sure. Questioning things. I've seen some really interesting UAP phenomenons in the sky. I've talked about it, and I know that's something that you. You are fascinated by. I have, you know, at the time, I also found a way to.

To see the Zapruder film, which, you know, was very fascinating as well, even though it's super grainy. And that kind of got me into questioning things. And then there's been a lot of really interesting things that have happened over the years. My grandfather, though, he, you know, I didn't get to know him that well, but I do know that he always questioned and believed that. That Roosevelt knew about the Japanese coming, and that always struck with him because he. He was super patriotic. And another one of my heroes, Pat Tillman, who left the NFL to join the army. His death is very suspicious as well, in that. Not the fact we know that he was killed by friendly fire, but the way they handled his body afterwards, his uniform, confiscating his last journal, using his death to prop up the war propaganda. There's been a lot of great people in history who are super patriotic, who've questioned their government, and I think that's what I've done since I wasn't a kid.

And pardon my ignorance, I didn't even know that about Tillman's journal. So that was confiscated by the.

His uniform was burned and his journal was confiscated. That's in John Krakauer's book where men win Glory, which is a fantastic book. And one of my best friends in the entire world, AJ Hawke. AJ grew his hair out, him and his buddy in 2004, as an ode to. To Pat, because Pat always had long hair, played for the Cardinals, left a multimillion dollar contract to go fight, fight al Qaeda and Taliban gets over there and is like, what the fuck am I doing? I'm guarding these poppy fields. It's not what I signed up for. I miss my wife. I miss in the States. This is not what I thought we were going to be doing over here. And then some really negligent maneuvers happened and split up his unit, and he ended up being with one of the members of the afghani army, who was their kind of guide. And, you know, a guy saw the guy and in some dim lighting on the ridge, who was with Pat, they fired on him. Obviously, Pat and the Afghani thought that they were getting fired on by Taliban, so fired back and end up. Pat got killed.

His brother was not told right away that it was friendly fire. They come like, it's all in the book. It's a fascinating book. I mean, it's one of the only books I've ever cried reading just because it's so. I mean, John's an incredible writer. He wrote into thin air. He wrote into the wild. He wrote under the banner of heaven.

I read those three. I read the Tillman book.

Yeah, the Tillman book is incredible. But I don't know why I'm bringing this up. Just that there's so many people that really love this country. They've gotten disenfranchised. I think that's part of it.

They've been betrayed by their leadership.

Yeah.

I mean, for your grandfather, who you said lost friends at Pearl harbor and was shot down over Europe and held.

As a pow by, you know, recently, there's a gentleman writing a book about me, and he's writing a chapter on him. And he went and found the war crime committee that actually interviewed him after he came back because he was mistreated over there. There was one of his, one of the guys. There's a group of, like. I think there were ten people on his. On his bomber. One of the guys ruptured his spleen on the way down, and they mistreated him. Made him march, like, 20 miles in the freezing cold. Didn't get him any medical treatment. So there was, like, a war crimes commission that was doing interview. So he was interviewed about that, and it talked about kind of how he was treated, you know, how they put, you know, worms in his food and dignified water for certain times, and. And just the bad conditions they were in. And that's all he went through. He went through all that because, you know, he really cared about his country. And I think even up until his death, you know, there was for sure some bitterness, I would guess, around what was I actually doing and why was I doing it and who had to die, you know, my friends at Pearl harbor, you know, for this country that I fucking loved, that I almost died for.

That's right.

And I think those are the great people that have made this country what it is. And we're now to even question the government. You're some right wing, conspiracy crazy tinfoil hat wearer, which is wild, because it seems like the left has gone so far left and anybody right of that. There's no center anymore. According to the left, you're just. You're a right winger. Unless you were so far on the left. The left used to be a party of occupants. Wall street and free speech and rights for everybody now is. They're the ones beating the drums on the war machine and censorship and obedience.

They're not criticizing Wall street too much, I notice.

Yeah.

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Or donate securely@preborn.com. Tucker. That's preborn.com, Tucker. There was a fascinating study, a very revealing study, that showed that at the height of Occupy Wall street, the New York Times torqued up its coverage of racism. So the word racist racism, white supremacy, went up hundreds of percent in the New York Times. You can check all this on their database. During Occupy Wall street, it was almost like somebody decided it would be better to be at war with each other than to be asking questions about our financial system.

It's not surprising that's what they do, that they distraction. The true disinformation comes from actually those, those publications.

Now, how have they treated you?

A lot of character assassinations, I've noticed when I tested positive for COVID. The whole, my whole world changed. And people I thought were allies in the media just turned on me. They spammed my sponsors, you know, to the tune of one of my sponsors who was having a hard time keeping me, said they got spammed with 140 million impressions across all social media to get rid of me because of my choice about what I want to put in my body. They didn't. To their credit, they stuck with me for one more year. One of the sponsors dropped me within a couple days, which is fine. But, yeah, you know, when it came out, whether it was somebody from the campaign or not, released, that I was a finalist to be Bobby's vice president, there was a total character assassination. It was some bizarre story from twelve years ago that somebody thought they heard something, that I was questioning something. And what it all comes down to.

I think that was CNN that did that.

Yeah, of course, is I'm not beholden. You know, I have a contract, but I don't, you know, I'm not beholding anybody. I'm dangerous to them because I speak my mind. You know, I'm not, you know, cliche ridden, you know, obedient star athlete. I, like, speak my mind. I'm a loose cannon to them.

But why? I mean, wouldn't just be easier to collect the accolades and collect the money and just not say what you think in public? Keep it for dinner parties.

Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of people have done that over the years. Yeah. There's been a lot of great stars who've done that. And I respect that. I think I just, I love. I love this country and I believe in this country. I believe in people too much to just be quiet about things that seem so obvious to me and corruption in any form should be exposed. And the evils in this world that are out there and there's good and there's evil and the powers that be that don't want to the light to shine the good to exist, you know, really push, push things that aren't in the best interest of anybody. And I just got tired of dealing with it. I also got to a point that Rogan got to, I think, and many other people where I made my money, I have a platform. I've had success in my business. What's the worst that you could do to me? Like you could kill me. Yeah. At least I'm not dying on my knees.

Amen.

And stand up for what I believe in, whether you agree with me or not, whether you agree with the way I went about it. That's your own opinion. That's fine. But I feel. Yeah, I feel good about. About the way that I've stood up for myself. And like Bobby said, there's a lot worse things than dying. And, like, I would be dying a little bit every single day if I didn't say some of the stuff that's on my mind now. I do want to, like, not be a part of the, you know, the war against the people that tried to cancel us. I would rather be a part of bringing people back into the fold and actually building bridges with some of those people. Now, there's the evil that exists that I don't care to engage with those people, and they know who they are. Most people that have attacked me that are beholden to big pharma or money or whatever it might be, but I think if there's a chance for this country to keep going and to exist and to not be like the roman empire and fall from within, and I don't know if that's even possible, honestly.

But I think it's got to start with love and compassion and empathy, and I'd like to be a part of that conversation if possible.

I so strongly agree with that. And clearly COVID was used. Like, race questions have been used. Like, the trans stuff is being used to divide people and to make them hate each other and that. And you don't want to be a part of that. I don't want to make that worse at all. And I agree with you. I love the country, and not only do I love it, I'm stuck here. You know, I'm born here, I will die here. So it's my country. That's how I feel. So I don't want it to get worse. But I do have unanswered in my mind, like, what was that? I mean, you described, I think, the motives of the people that you know or I know, you know, they were afraid. They're just instinctively deferential to power. Okay, that's fine. That's all human nature. But, like, big picture, that's so crazy what just happened. And the effects on people are so.

Bad, and we don't know what the effects could be.

We certainly don't.

There's gonna be years.

It crosses the blood brain barrier. So, like, what is this? And it's absolutely fair to ask the question, does it change your DNA? That's not crackpots science at all. And there's some evidence.

Well, they admitted early on, if they'd called this experimental gene therapy, nobody would have taken it. So they called it a vaccine, and they changed the definition of vaccine. Like, that's not. That's not bullshit, that's not conspiracy. That's actually what happened. They literally talked about this. I believe, as somebody at the who, CDC, one of those, too. You can. Somebody can check me on that. But there's literally a conversation that they were having where they're like, well, if we'd called this gene therapy, it would have been maybe we thought it was about five to 10% of people that might take this. We call it a vaccine. Then that brings in all the potential being canceled as an anti vaxxer, because that's what they did to me and you as well. They have this game plan where it's like we're a name call anti vaxxer, anti semite, bigot, racist, whatever it might be. We're going to censor you, then we're going to try and cancel you, then we're going to go after the people that you love and care about. And that's kind of how they do it. And so if they call it a vaccine, then all these people who are hesitant to not get canceled, not be ashamed by being called an anti vaxxer are going to get in line to take it.

But big picture, do you have any guess as to, like, what is the program here? Like, what is the point of this? Is it depopulation? Because that's its effect. Of course. The lockdowns and the vax depopulate by definition. Well, you said massive miscarriage rate, but also just keeping people inside for a year and a half destroys their ability to find a mate. Destroys their souls.

Like immune system. Yeah.

And its effect on your immune system. Exactly. It causes illness.

I think there's some people that. Yeah, that won't. Depopulation. Now, there's been, you know, video of, you know, Bill Gates that, you know, has. People think it's taken out of context, but if you look at his track record and what he's done around the world, I don't know that he's a proponent of, like, all life and, you know, people having more kids and more population on this earth.

I think he's strongly pro death, from what I can tell.

I think he's not the only one. I think there's a lot of other people. I don't understand what that motivation is, why, but I think those are some of the evils that we're up against.

Are you noticing all around, just in your life, are you noticing people begin to make reference to spiritual forces in a way they didn't say five years ago. Is this my imagination?

No, I don't think so. I think that. I think that more people are kind of waking up to that. I think people that watched, and there's probably, I don't know, 1015, 20 million at least, that saw your interview on Rogan and saw you talk about the spirit of the supernatural component of UAPs. I think that is a good part of the conversation for people to reference. I grew up in the church, and in the church, you know that there's a battle that's going on between the scene and the unseen world, but between good and evil, between the powers that we can see and the powers that we can't see. And there's some wild things out there that we don't know about, and there's some government secrets we don't know about. At a bare minimum, whether you believe in alien life, UFO's, Uaps, whatever you want to call it, there's some technology out there that exists that finally have some sort of disclosure that the government or the powers that be don't think we're ready to be given that information, which is kind of wild. And I understand that. I actually don't understand it. The thought process is it's going to change the way that we look at life or religion or whatever that gets in.

The whole other idea about religion being as a way to control people, control thought, maybe, which is pretty wild. But disclosure, I think, needs to happen. It's going to be interesting to see how it happens, where it happens, you know, in my space, where I'm at, where I do a lot of plant medicine, the veils between world get worlds, and dimensions get very thin. So the idea of seeing other entities, seeing, you know, angelic type of beings and demonic type beings, is very normal. And the idea that there's a demonic aspect to the UAP phenomenon, I think, is very plausible and interesting.

I do, too. So you say plant based medicine. I think you're referring probably to a lot of different things, but among those would be, say, ayahuasca or psilocybin mushrooms. So the conventional understanding is that if you take a hallucinogen, you see hallucinations, things that your brain creates that don't exist outside of you. But you're suggesting that you can see things that are, in effect, real, but that you don't normally see. Is that what you're saying?

Yes, definitely. And I've done. I have many times now, and I've had many incredible experiences, finally feel comfortable talking about it. I wasn't. Maybe after the first, like, six times I sat, and then I finally said, you know what? This has made a huge impact on my life and made me feel more connected to this world and more loving more in my heart. And even this last ceremony, group of ceremonies that I did, I think has really helped me with the last four years of my life, where I went from a pretty beloved semi enigma still, but pretty beloved athlete to very polarizing figure. And it's helped me to kind of put that all in the right context, in perspective, and actually have a ton of gratitude for the whole process, even though it's tough up and down and. And more empathy and compassion for those who've, like, slandered me and canceled me or attempted to. So it's been. It's been really important for me and really, really deep healing for me.

Well, if you wind up with more compassion for your enemies, it's hard to criticize it, because I think that's. That's where we need to be.

Well, they also couldn't criticize because I. The first time I did it, I won an MVP, and the second time I did it, I won MVP again. So everybody wanted to, you know, put me in the, like, druggie category. Oh, you're just some wild, hippie, druggy guy. It's like, yeah. But also, I'm better at football, probably afterwards, and a better leader and better at relating to my teammates. So there's a lot of positive.

What does your teammate say? What do they say in general?

They're interested, very interested. So many people from all different sports. I'm talking basketball players, tennis players, players, golfers, baseball players, hockey players, and then my own contemporaries in the league are all interested about it. There's a base level of plant medicine use. For the most part, I would say it's marijuana. And, you know, people have their own opinions about marijuana, but a lot of people are really interested about the healing effects they can have and the self. Deeper sense of self love and deeper sense of connection. There's just so many myths about it and misnomers, I like to say, and kind of revised my view of that. Plant medicine is. People like, oh, plant medicine, what is this shit? Blah, blah, blah. Medicine is anything that is healing that's not addictive, and drugs are substances that are addictive, and there's a ton of drugs, and not all pharma's bad. There's some incredible pharmaceutical stuff that's helped us with. With things that I've used. Obviously, I've had many surgeries and had anesthesia, and I'm thankful for those types of drugs. But medicine and food as medicine has been really impactful for my life. And they're not addictive substances.

They're stuff that I like to use with deep reverence in ceremony setting. And it's made a big impact on my life. The people that know me have noticed a change. People that don't know me, you know, have their. Their shots and their opinions about me, but. But I do have more empathy and compassion for all those people and. And for myself, too. And I'm just trying to do my best. And I was fighting a lot of battles, you know, when I tested positive for COVID and got canceled or attempted. And I don't feel like I need to fight as much, much of those. What about you, though? Because you. You did one of the most controversial, somehow not to me, most controversial interviews in the last. I don't know how long. When you went to Russia and did Putin, how did it feel coming back? Because, like, anybody watched the interview was like, number one, it was fucking awesome. Number two, Putin came off as an interesting, thoughtful, smart individual. And if you've read 1984, you know, the base game plan of government control is you have to have an enemy and you have to slander that enemy, regardless if you know anything about them.

And I think a lot of people are like, oh, poop. Apologists are, like, whitewashing all the stuff that he's done to the different people. And I was just like, no, I'd love to see Joe Biden give an interview where he can speak on the history of the United States in the same way that Putin talked about the history of his country.

I'd love to see Biden do an interview where he shows how to operate a microwave. And I don't think that's going to happen. And by the way, Biden won't do interviews, and neither will Zelensky so far.

What was it like to come back? And you were in a couple of the places after that?

Yeah, I went to the Middle east after that for a while.

While.

I mean, I was out of the country for almost a month, so I missed. And I don't ever read about myself anyway because I know who I am. I don't need someone to tell me. So I missed all of that, as I always do. But the idea that someone would criticize an interview where you just let the guy talk for a couple hours, I mean, I just think that's inherently useful. I mean, I just wanted to do it as a documentary record of what Putin is like, or at least what he's like in this context. And people can decide for themselves. I'm a big believer in letting people decide, decide for themselves. I think adult men have the right to come to their own conclusions about things adults have the right to. So I'll never stop believing that because we're not slaves. We can have any opinion we want. And if you don't like it, then try and change it through reason. And if you can't, then fuck you. And I really feel that way. So that's the kind of perspective I had going into talk to Putin. My perceptions of him are exactly what you just said.

I thought he was an interesting guy, smart guy, impressive guy. You know, in some ways, obviously a lot more impressive than Joe Biden, but he's russian and he runs Russia. And I'm american, and I live in America, so I care about my country. I want my leaders to be better. I'm not on Putin's side. I don't have any emotional attachment to any foreign country because I'm not a foreigner. I'm an american, and this is the only country I care about. But for the record, yeah. I thought people can watch it and.

Assess for themselves, and they should. It's a fascinating.

But the idea that you shouldn't be allowed to do that is so crazy to me. I'm just not going to submit to that.

Being canceled by the people who have, like, just bowed down and given interviews from their knees to the Zelensky's of.

The world gargling as they interview. Yes.

It's wild as this guy comes over in fucking. An outfit you'd wear to the, you know, to the store on a Sunday morning to ask to Congress for another $100 billion is fucking wild.

He looks like he's gonna be in the, you know, village people music video. I mean, it's, like, insane. The whole thing is, like, insane. You do sort of wonder like that and a million other things going on right now. You wonder if they're. They're sort of seeing how far they can push the population until someone starts laughing, like, are you joking?

It feels like that sometimes. What can we. What if we did this? Is anybody gonna give a shit? No.

Okay.

Okay. Now let's try this one here. We're gonna put Joe Biden up into this. Wait, what? This guy, who can't even walk over here, shits his pants every now and.

Then, we're gonna pick the single dumbest but most self confident person in the entire nation. Of 350 million people and make her White House press secretary. And you have to deal with this every day on your television. No, I know it's. Well, I'm gonna.

But that's not. But the real question I had for you in relation to freedom of speech and free speech is two, I believe, champions of free speech who are now in exile. Julian Assange and Ed Snowden.

I know them both.

And you've had conversations with them both, people who expose corruption. And there was attempted murders on both of them? Yes, both are alive. Julian is kind of rotting in a cell right now, I believe, and Ed is in his own exile in Russia, but thriving, it seems like. Yes, but both people who I have a lot of affection for, just the fact that they would do what they did and expose what they exposed and knew the consequences. How do you feel about those two, and do you think there's any path back, whether it's, uh, Trump or Bobby? Maybe not even Trump? Because I feel like Trump didn't do it. But if Bobby were to get elected, the opportunity to. To pardon those people, would they come back to the states, you think? Would they?

Well, I mean, in the case of, uh, Snowden, who's stuck, who I like a lot, and, um. And as with him and Assange, I don't agree with them on everything. I don't agree with my kids and everything. I don't have to agree. We agree on the things.

I don't either. I just.

And by the way, if I'm being totally honest, I probably do agree with them on most things, but. But whatever. I'm sure you'd find every area.

I just love that they expose corruption and that they're.

Their bravery, their physical courage, those guys, their willingness to suffer for what they believe and the principles for which they're suffering, you know, the dignity of the individual. We're all created by God. You cannot treat me like a slave. You cannot tell me what to think. You cannot tell me what to say. You cannot lie to my face, period, because I have self respect and that.

There is a field of value. This is right, this is wrong. What was going on was wrong. And we got exposes.

Well, and Snowden especially. I mean, Snowden, you know, Assange is australian, he's lived around the world. He was a journalist. I don't think he had any expectation that he would wind up spending his adult life in prison. I don't think that even crossed his mind. Maybe it did. I haven't asked him, but Ed Snowden knew exactly what he was getting into. And he was, you know, middle class american, high iq guy, lots of job opportunities here. He could have lived a very comfortable life with his wife and kids, and he intentionally put all of that at risk in order to tell Americans what their government was actually doing. And what's crazy to me is not that the US government is trying to murder him, which, of course, they are, but that news organizations don't defend himself. That's when you realize the new quote, news business is totally fraudulent. None of these people mean it. They went into it. These are people who went into the news business as a way to exercise and exert power over their fellow Americans. Like, it's nothing with informing people. It has to do with controlling and oppressing them. That's why you work at NBC News, so you can control people.

It's really sick. And my loathing for them just can't even be described in words because it's so profound. I have not forgiven them, and I don't think I will. But Snowden, yes, Snowden would come back tomorrow. He's american, his wife's american. I think he's got a fine life in Russia, but he's not russian. And ultimately, I mean, I don't know, if you've lived abroad, you probably haven't had time, but if you spend enough time in foreign countries, you realize that no matter how wonderful they are, they're not your country. You know what I mean? You'll never fully be a citizen of another country if you were born here. So he wants to come back and they won't let him. And it's disgusting.

It's disgusting that they would use a term like traitor for him when he's literally exposing government corruption and stuff that you should give a shit about.

If. If I catch you robbing a liquor store and call the police, am I the criminal? No, you're the criminal. You're robbing a liquor store. Ed Snowden exposed crimes by the US government against the american population. Us citizens were paying for this, were being spied on illegally. And he's the criminal. No, no, no. He's the hero. You are the criminal. Mike Pompeo, director of the CIA, who is literally a criminal.

Yeah.

And yet he's treated like, I mean, he's in the running to be defense secretary if Donald Trump wins. It's shocking. Take a criminal and give him nuclear weapons. Really?

But that's been the whole revolving door with government, with the cabinet. That happens. Revolving door from the FDA to the CDC to who? It's a secret handshake society. Of everybody just patting each other's back and staying in it. That's the corruption that needs to be exposed. And it's out there, it's utter, and they're just doing it so overtly. Who gives a shit?

Well, in very high stakes too. It's not just like, well, I'm not doing the best possible job as transportation secretary. It's like, no, actually I'm forcing the entire country to take poison. I'm killing people, I'm destroying the US economy for the benefit of a few, et cetera, et cetera. These are like, these are big things. These are not minor fuck ups. These are like, these are major felonies in my opinion.

And that's why, I mean, that's why I have hope. And I want Bobby to have a chance to debate and to get into it. Because if not, it's just gonna be the same shit over and over and over. And like when the financial crisis happened in zero eight, right, and Obama put many of the people involved in it into his cabinet, into the, into the, you know, the Department of Treasury was like one of the guys from Goldman and Sachs, I believe, who was a part of the whole fucking shit. They went down. And that's on the inside job, which is a great thing.

So maybe we take the captain of the Titanic and make him secretary of the Navy.

Yeah, but that's, that's basically what you're doing.

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I think he loves standing up to the man, to the big corruption. Now he is royalty because the Kennedy family is one of those special families. And his family has been a part of, in a position of power or fame, riches for a long time. But look at his life and what he's done. He's gone after the EPA forever and he gets shit for his vaccine stance, but he was never a part of that. It was actually a couple women who came up to him when he was suing the EPA for years and winning for them, destroying our water and destroying people's lives and winning consistently. And then he's like, oh, shit, there's another issue that's going on. It's the chronic disease epidemic in this country. And he can give you all the numbers from what it was. And there's certain dates in time where certain things happen, where chronic disease went way up in the eighties, specifically after a bill was signed by Ronald Reagan. And since that time, if you look at a lot of the numbers, there's been a huge jump in chronic disease for kids in illness and SIds and autism, allergies, all these different things.

And he's just saying, listen, I'm not saying that causation is correlation 100%, but there has to be some sort of relationship here with this. And why don't we do some studies on it? Why don't we get some transparency? Why don't we have these vaccines go through the normal trials and testing?

Because learning things is anti science.

Yeah, but I don't think Bobby would put those kind of people in his cabinet. I don't think he would give power to those kind of people. You know, like, I've talked to him. You know, as frustrating as some of the Alphabet gangs or organizations are, there's a lot of great people in them. There's great people in the CIA, there's great people in the FBI, there's great people in the CDC and the who and the FDA who really care, like and think they're making a difference. But there's a top line in a lot of organizations that are actually, at their core, anti american and are not doing things that's in the best interest of our people, and we're fucking paying them. It's on our dime. And all the stuff that's happened post 911, you know, with the Patriot act and the FISA court, as far as the surveillance domestically in spying, and the fact that they are not actually unearthing these, like, domestic terrorist plots, you know, there's a lot of great documentaries and stuff. You can look into that. The fact that our food and water is not at a acceptable level, the fact that our border is not at the right level, the fact that some of the stuff that happened with ATF where some of those, they were tracking these guns that went to the cartel and they were being used to kill border agents and all these different shit that's gone on that.

Again, I'm not saying that all those organizations are super corrupt. There's a lot of fucking great men and women that work for those, but there's some people at the top who aren't great people, and that's what needs to change. And I think Bobby would go in there and change a lot of that stuff, and that's what his uncle and his father were trying to do. If you know the history of.

How'd that turn out?

Well, yeah, that's what happens with some of these companies, and that's why I love Bobby and. And you. Because you're willing to stand up knowing that it doesn't always end well for people going up.

This is a guy whose uncle and dad were murdered in the course of their jobs as elected officials.

Well, look at the history of Alan Dulles, right?

Yeah.

If you know his history, he was in banking for the Bush family. Then he got into the OSS, which is the precursor to the CIA.

Yes.

And he was probably a part of Operation Paperclip, which repatriated a lot of the german scientists.

Yes.

Which there's some ethical issues with that. He tried to get us into world War three in Cuba, Operation North woods, and the majority of JFK's actually closest advisors, I believe they voted, and the majority said, let's do it, and let's blow up the ship and let's get us into World War three and let's go after Cuba. And JFK said, nope, ain't doing it. Fired Alan. And then Alan Dulles winds up where as basically one of the main guys in the, in the Warren commission, Chief Justice Warren, was, I believe, only at nine of the 30 some odd meetings that they had. But the two guys that were really in control of it, from what I've read, are Alan Dulles, former fire head of the CIA, who ended up getting his job back. And there's an airport named after him. And Gerald Ford, future president, who was, at the time, number two at the FBI, an FBI led by J. Edgar Hoover, who hated the Kennedys.

So given that all of that happened, it's a little weird that the Biden administration won't give Bobby Kennedy Secret Service protection.

Yeah. And he's known Joe forever. Like, they were friendly for a long, long time. It wasn't like he's some outsider, like, he's been around the political game for a long time, and he's the only major candidate who's not gotten Secret Service protection. They're also limiting and skewing, I believe, some of the polls to try and not just keep him out of a debate, but keep him out of secret service protection. He's spending millions of his own dollars on private security, which he has to because he's a threat, because he's not bought and paid for, and he's a foil to the two party system. But I don't know if you saw this, but Bobby recently came out and said in the summer months, at some point, he wants to do a 50 state poll with, like, 20,000. I don't know what the exact number is. Votes in each of these states. And whoever polls lower between him and Joe Biden has to drop out of the race, because in his own analytics, he's found out that if the three of them run, Trump is most likely to win. If he goes against Trump, he wins. If he goes against Biden, he wins.

If Biden goes against Trump, Trump wins. So, in fact. So he said, hey, listen, I'll drop out if you pull higher than me in these 50 states, but if I pull higher than you, you're out. There's no way he'll go for that. I think it's a brilliant model to be like, no, no, I'm not the foil. Bobby's not the foil. Right. Bobby's a main player in this and going through this process and just, like, entertaining it for a small time to learn about the corruption with getting on a ballot is. That's fucking wild.

It is.

50 states with 50 different ways of doing it for the most part. You know, you can have your signatures thrown out if you have the wrong color ink on one of 50,000 signatures. Some states you file with the secretary of state, some states with the governor's office. It's just. It's so ridiculous. The whole process, which is just set up for a two party system. Right? And then who knows about the, you know, the safety and legitimacy of this whole thing.

Well, it's a lot harder to get on the ballot than it is for, say, a non citizen to vote.

Yeah. Or dead person.

Or a dead person.

A lot of those.

So you made reference a couple of times to the food supply and you said, I don't know about, you know, I'm not an expert in vaccines, but I am an expert on food.

Well, I'm not an expert on food.

Well, I mean, it's your job.

Yeah, I mean, I care. I care a lot about what goes in my body.

You have to. Right. So what have you learned? So, for people who aren't paying as close attention to what they eat, what. Where do you think the. The bad, like, what's the bad food?

Well, a lot of it's in the wording of it. I mean, fat is a bad term, but fat is really good for you. Um, cholesterol is also a real negative stuff.

Yeah, yeah.

But you need cholesterol because it's good for your brain. Those. There's some bad types of it and some, like, shit that you can eat, that doesn't help your, uh, that kind of skews your levels. But sugar, terrible for you. Anything processed sugar, like, fuels cancer cells. So eliminating sugars, processed foods.

But if you were to start with one, it would be getting rid of sugar.

Yeah, definitely. And then fasting. Fasting is incredible for your body. It resets your body. I do at least a five day fast every single off season. Just kind of kickstart the off season.

Doctor Justin, what's that like?

It's. It's a fun process. It's hard, but after you get past three days, you have this evolutionary impulse that kicks in and you feel amazing. Actually, I got to the fifth day this year. I was like, man, if I wasn't going on this trip and I would do ten days, I felt incredible. Yeah. And it just resets your body. And actually, there's a lot of great research. Dana White was talking about it recently that you know, he did kind of before and after testing, and there's a. There's a lot of studies now that talk about the. The percentage of it goes way down of heart disease. Heart attack based on fasting. Cancer obviously has a really hard time when you fast or when you at least fast from sugar. And that's kind of my problem with the whole, you know, the cancer industrial complex, is that there's very little people treating cancer that kind of start base level of diet. And I'm not saying that all treatments are terrible. There's a lot of people doing really great work and caring for patients, but diet should be the first thing that you look at, especially sugar.

I had a weird experience. I was at the hospital years ago, seeing a friend and a coach of mine who had a heart issue. And I got there, he'd gotten two stents put in, drinking a coke and eating pudding. And I'm like, what the fuck are you doing? What are you doing? And that's part of the problem, is we're not using food as medicine.

Well, sugar's also, as someone who has quit smoking and drinking and drugs, I can say way more addictive than it's a drug.

It's addicting, like, actually.

Yeah.

But in every single day, there's stuff that's finally coming out. Like, I was just reading something. There's four. Or it was like, oreos, lucky charms, something else. And Gatorade has been exposed as having forever chemicals in them. So there's finally people getting some of the message out and forcing these companies to change. But the best way to vote in general is with your money. I really believe that. Obviously, I love that. If Bobby would win, and we'll definitely vote for him. And voting on a local level is really important, especially for your local das and sheriffs and different things is super important, but voting with our dollar is really important. And companies that are involved in shady practices, unethical practices, foods that have poison in them, and they know it. No biome. And they'll change. They'll change just like with the government. If you don't, you know, don't follow their ridiculous, draconian rules, they're going to change.

So it sounds like protein is the answer.

Yeah, protein, fat, I mean, that's hype. Everybody has a little difference, so a little different body, a little different constitution. So, um, you know, but I think on a base level, fasting is good. Now, a lot of the intermittent fasting data for women was post menopausal women. Um, I will. I definitely know that. So like a fasting, intermittent fasting for like, um, women. Still menstruating. I don't know. That's great for health, but I think fasting in general is a good reset for your body.

How hard are the first three days?

Hard, but it changes your relationship with food. Now we're not living to eat, we're eating to live. I think that's an important distinction.

Do you feel lightheaded or jumpy or a little bit.

It depends on how much sugar you've eaten. You can get the sugar blues and the sugar depression there if you're coming off eating a ton of sugar, for sure. But I don't eat a lot of sugar. So, um, it was, it was fairly easy for me. But I do all the time too. I think it's like, just start with 24 hours. Just start with 24 hours and just drink water or bone broth, um, as a good reset. And then if you can get to three days, that's great. Get to five. That's incredible. The research says five and up has, like, the greatest benefits, but it's a good reset for your system. Um, you look better in the mirror and you'll. Your body just starts function a little bit higher while you're fasting. Yeah.

Is that hard?

Yeah, it's lighter workouts when I'm my fast, but because I need some energy to work out.

But what's the longest you've gone fasting?

Yeah, seven.

What was that like?

Awesome. Past three is, like, amazing. I think it goes back to, like, the hunter gatherer where you. You haven't had food in a few days and you get this fucking energy jolt from your system to go find food. And after three days, I feel amazing. I don't even need food and then just ease back into some stuff on day eight, you know, but, but I love it. I did some ayurvedic stuff as well. Um, like a 30 day ayurvedic diet. And that was incredible for my sister.

What is that?

It's just eating, uh, and doing kind of a full body flush reset like they do in India. It's their kind of way of doing medicine and, man, that reset my entire system. I lost, I lost weight, my stomach lining changed for sure. I went in being allergic to a lot of things and having, like, irritable bowel syndrome. I came out of those 30 days with, like, no allergies, no indigestion, no irritable bowel stuff, and it just, like, flipped. And I was.

What were you eating for 30 days on this?

Just mostly ayurvedic stuff. So rice, lentils, there's no meat and I love, you know, meat and protein, but yeah, just a lot of lentils and rice and vegetables.

What's a darkness? Is it a fat, like retreat? Yeah, retreat.

Well, you're just in a room about, I don't know, a third of this size, probably with a little bathroom, bathtub, and can't see shit.

Nothing.

Nothing. Can't see anything. You start hallucinating like I did, five nights, four days. You start hallucinating like on the third day because your brain starts, the DMT starts getting activated.

Is it hard to text in that environment?

Yeah, very hard. No.

So you're actually in touch. Total darkness.

Total darkness. No concept for what time it is, especially after the first couple days because you sleep so much the first night. After that you don't need to sleep hardly at all because you have no stimulation for your eyes. So you're not really tired. You're just kind of laying there, uh, or moving around. I was like, you know, did yoga, did long meditations, sat in the bath for a couple hours. It seemed like, I don't know, time was irrelevant. But, uh, a lot of great contemplation, the math.

So you've like feeling your way to the back?

Oh, yeah. And a lot of times you start hallucinating and seeing different shapes and doorways and stuff. And you just run into stuff all the time. And it's a, it's a great process.

Scarier than any drug. I think I would be afraid to do that.

Yeah, I'm glad I did it. I don't need to do it again. It's not like something I need to, I can't wait to do another darkness retreat. It's like, no, I did that. Check that box. That was cool. Not going to do it again.

What did you think about?

I started each day with a meditation and just said, what do I want to contemplate today? So contemplated relationships, family, and then two days was, one was I'm retired, and one was unplanned. And so I went through all the insecurities around retirement and then all the fears around playing again and just really spent hours just like thinking through things. And anytime a negative thought would come in, just being curious about it and wondering where that comes from, if there's a root of that. Is there something from childhood that is involved in that fear, insecurity. And it was really amazing for me, just the healing that happened. And I came out really feeling comfortable either way. Like not scared of retirement, not scared of. Of slipping into irrelevance. I actually welcome that. Not. Not worried about what the future looks like if I don't play for the packers anymore. And I'm on a new team and new guys, new city. So I was really, really meaningful. I'm really glad I did that again. Don't need to maybe do five days, four nights, but. But it was a good experience. Have you done anything like that?

No. I've spent my whole life running away from stuff like that.

But nobody even, like, can take a few minutes to get off their phone. You know, you probably are better than most.

Oh, I definitely am. No, I take a sauna every day for 20 minutes in silence.

But do you watch tv?

No, we don't have a tv.

Yeah, tv. That's a good way.

I like silence. I don't like noise. I don't actually watch any video at all, ever, and. But to be without in total darkness for five nights, you know, I don't know what would happen. Were you afraid at all?

No, but the weirdest thing was night one. I had a bad dream, like a nightmare. And when you're normally. When you're at home, you have, like, a weird dream. Something's off. Maybe you see a feeling entity or just something's freaking you out. What do you do? You kind of wake up, orient yourself. Okay, I'm on my bed. I'm fine. Here's this. Maybe I get up out of my bed, do something. Okay. I'm okay. And then you kind of are able to usually get back to sleep. In the darkness, what you see, eyes closed is what you see, eyes open. So there was no escaping the.

You wake up at 03:00 a.m. And got to take a leak. How long does it take you to get to the john?

Five minutes. Yeah. Because you just like, here's one step. Here's one step. And you're super disoriented. Just going really slow. Now feeling around, feeling around, feeling around. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Okay, there's. This should be here. Banging on something. Yeah, this should be over here. Okay, there. Here's a tiny little door. Okay, get in. Okay, now I gotta. You know, but I mean, in the. You just, you know, not really wearing clothes for the most part, just cause you don't need to use in complete darkness.

What's dinner like?

But the food was actually pretty good. So once a day, the food came at 06:00 there was, like, a double sided door, so he'd put the food in one side, close it. Then I'd open so there's no light, and you just, like, use your scent, like, smell. Be like, oh, that's. That's soup. I'm having that for dinner. Oh, here's. There was the food for the next day, too, so. Okay, there's some apples I'm having for breakfast. Oh, here's some. Some mixed nuts. I'm gonna have that for lunch as a snack. Oh, here's. What is this? Oh, this is some sort of, like, pasta. Okay, I'm gonna have this, that for lunch tomorrow. I was like, so you kind of going through it, and you just, like, you have all the time in the world, so you just, like, savor every bite and just eat super slow. And it's actually very meditative. That part was cool.

I've done a lot of hallucinogenic drugs. Not in many years, but I have when I was a child. And, um, you know, no matter how weird it gets, you feel like, well, it's the drug. But when there's total silence and darkness, are you worried that something's going to rise up from within you and scare the crap out of you?

Not really, because before that, I had done ayahuasca multiple times. I'd done psilocybin journeys, so I had figured out what it was like to surrender to a process or a ceremony. So I kind of treated that the same way and just said, you know what? What? Whatever comes up is what's supposed to come up. Like we say in doing ayah, like, the medicine will give you exactly what you need. So I kind of took that attitude into the darkness and said, whatever comes up is what I need in this moment, so I'm just going to surrender to it. And it's like, it's weird. I'm not on my phone. There's no distractions. There's really no sound. Like every now and then, like, in the afternoon, a plane would fly by above, and I was like, okay, it must be afternoon, you know, and then at 06:00 you knew was 06:00 because the dinner would come. That's the only reference for time that you knew. But I just surrendered to the process and said, I'm here for a reason. I've paid for this. So I enjoyed this experience, and I did. It was fun.

Did you feel like a medieval prisoner locked in? You weren't dungeon.

I could leave at any time I wanted. So the door was open, so if I wanted to leave, did anyone else.

Make it five nights?

Yeah, a lot of people. And somebody was coming out, actually, when I was going in who had been in 30, 30 nights. I could not believe that because I don't. I wouldn't want to do that. I mean, like, I think a 48 hours reset would be interesting, but even five days, four nights was like, okay, that's enough. You know, last person look. I mean, I didn't see them, but I heard they were a little bit depressed, which I can. I can imagine. Yeah. I heard your story on. On Rogan, though. Like, you definitely dabbled a little bit in some psychedelics. Did you?

A lot.

Was there ever any, like, real major breakthroughs that, like, stuck with you or was a lot of just, like, tripping? I mean, I'm going to go on.

To dead shows, you know, but still, it's a different country. Um, and, you know, it's just. It's so, so long ago and far away. It's hard to believe it's real, but, yeah, for sure. I mean, we.

But that was, like, in the seventies, right?

Eighties, yeah, mid eighties. And I just grew up in a world where drugs, certain drugs, were much more accepted than they are now. I'm not saying that's good, but, at all. But, you know, different time. But, yeah, no, I did. I've done a lot of that. And I decided, I mean, a long time ago, you know, I haven't had an advil in 22 years. I mean, I'm the soberest man you'll ever meet. But I was afraid. I mean, one thing I learned was there's a lot of stuff swirling around in. Inside you. And that's where the darkness retreat really struck me, because that would, you know, that stuff would rise right to the surface. And I'm not, you know, comfortable being in touch with all of that. And some of it is chaotic and scary, and it's not clear how much of it is from within and how much of it is from without. I didn't really believe in the unseen world when I was doing stuff like that, so I didn't really consider it, but I. Yeah, I saw some very scary things, and I was like, don't do that again. You know what I mean?

So, actually, I didn't get much out of it. And I remember once while taking LSD, I. When I was 15, I. You know, I was just too young to be doing that anyway. But I remember writing down, like, my profound thoughts as I was in the middle of this very, very far out experience. And they didn't make any sense. In fact, I found them in my barn in this building upstairs.

I need to see the generations of.

Family stuff stored a couple summers ago when I was like, I got to go through these boxes. Various diaries from deceased relatives, including my acid memoirs, which were really banal and fragmentary. What does this even mean? I think I threw them away. I want my kids seeing that. No, I didn't have any breakthroughs. I'll tell you, the breakthrough for me was sobriety. Just because I partied too much. So having to face things without a crutch, I felt really. And admit, you know, you're. I think all growth and joy begins with admitting who you really are, being honest about yourself.

Yeah, I agree.

But darkness retreat would maybe too much honesty for me.

You never know.

So you said you thought about what your life would be like if you kept playing with your other team or if you retired. I mean, at some point, you're gonna retire, right? What. What are you gonna do?

I'm gonna take a few deep breaths, relax a little bit, I think. I've been doing this for 25 years, playing football, 20 this year in the NFL. I've been mildly famous for the last, you know, 20 or so. 21, I guess. You know, I'd like to just take a step back and just, you know, enjoy life in a different way. I'd like to be a father at some point and take on that. That chapter in life, which is exciting to me.

But how hard is it to date when you're as famous as you are?

Oh, it's. It can be hard. Yeah, it can be hard, for sure. But I think, in general, you know, you become a pretty good judge of character over the years when you make mistakes and trust the wrong people. And whether it's business or personal life, you know, you can sniff some things out pretty quickly, I think, but you never know. And, you know, you. You met your soulmate when you're 15, right?

Yeah.

The most beautiful thing about that, which is the hardest thing about relationships in general that I've seen with my friends, is how do you grow together, you know, because you're a different person. 15. 2025 30 55. You know, but finding someone who's willing to, like, grow with you and be in what you're into and that you have your own separate life, which is beautiful and big and full, and then you can come together. And not having to find your, like, full identity in that other person, I think, is really important. So, you know, it's just trying to. To do all those things. I really just been trying to work on myself and ready myself because I've, you know, been way too codependent in relationships in the past where I kind of lost myself to, like, hold on to this idea of what I think a relationship is, and it's just not. It hasn't been sustainable for me. But I'm confident that there'll be a time when that, when that comes, comes together, and till then, I'll just be enjoying myself.

Since you spent the majority of your life famous at this point, what do you think of that? What do you think of being famous?

It has its pluses, for sure. It's not ever anything I signed up for. I just love to play football, and my fame grew, really, around the same time we won the Super bowl, and then I did a state farm commercial. And it's actually true. It's like, it's funny, but it's true. Like, I became the state farm guy. At the same time I became a Super bowl champion and an MVP, ultimately, and my life from 2011 on just really took a whole different change. Before that, I was recognizable, I would say after that, I was famous.

Yeah.

And I was like the famous football player, also adman pitch guy for state farm. So more people knew me, and I love my privacy, and that got totally kind of taken away. So. So I went through, I don't know if you felt like this, but I've definitely gone through phases of being a recluse, for sure. I just don't want to go out, don't want to see anybody, and I don't really like that. I mean, I am introverted in general, but I love people I love, like, my routine, and I feel like I got so just scared of not having my privacy or just, like, annoyed that I just stopped doing things that I enjoy doing, and I just didn't really like doing that. So now I do exactly what I want to do when I want to do it and try and have a little bit of sense of humor with some of the reactions that come from people or situations where I can't just have privacy and just find a little more humor in it. It seems to transmute some of the frustration of fear into joy in those moments. What about you? I mean, you've.

Oh, I could write a book on it. Yeah, I'm not into it at all, but, yeah, you can definitely become a recluse, for sure.

Some people, though, in your business, and my business kind of signed up for it. That's what they want.

Those are the saddest of all people. You want to be famous. You want to be loved by people who've never met you.

That's like kids, these days are saying, what do you want to be when you grow up? It's not a fireman or athlete or something. It's famous or an influencer.

Well, to influence people, I think, is a great honor. And.

But that's not what they're talking about.

And can be a joy. Right. But to be well known is. No, of course it's a nightmare. There's no upside whatsoever. And if you find that important, then you're a hollow, sad person. That's like, what do you. What is, you know? But who? I mean, one thing I noticed about famous people, I've always noticed is having spent a lot of time around them for the last 30 years, is they all know each other. You ever notice that?

Yes. Yeah, there's a knowing. I think you kind of know what the other. What that person's going through. So there's a base level of like, oh, we kind of know how to navigate this life in a similar fashion. So there's like that. There's that just closeness, I think that comes with initial meaning of like, oh, we probably have similar experiences. So there's like, that connection kind of off the bat with that. I mean, I'm sure you feel that.

Yeah, I have a big family, so that really helps. So, yeah, I don't have that many famous friends, but some. But I. I don't know.

I was looking at your bordeaux.

Well, I've had a lot of. A lot of people in this barn. But when you're going through, like, for example, when you tested positive for Rona and. And then you admitted that you were part of the despised, unvaxed. Yeah, you were a criminal.

Immunized.

Immunized. And the world just, like, comes down on your head. And your agent, I don't know if your sponsors are calling you, maybe.

Yes, they are.

Of course they are. Right. And I'm sure the league is calling you and you're just under bombardment. Who do you talk to about? Is there, do you have people in your life who can buck you up?

You have a great support system. I think it the last couple years, and I'm sure you feel the same way, but the last ten years. But every year it seems to get even smaller. But the circle kind of constricts a little bit, and there's just. There's less people who know exactly what's going on. And there's just a really tight knit group of the inside of the inside. And there's a beautiful group outside of that who you love and you talk to and you spend some time time with. But they don't know everything, and they don't get to because there's just certain things that's only meant for a really small group of people, and I love that. And so those people are my moroccs, and they're not. Yes, people. They're people that can tell me exactly what's going on and what I need to hear, not what I want to hear. But there's a really small group.

So you keep the ass kissers out of your life.

Yeah, there's a lot of them.

Oh, I know.

Yes. You want to be involved.

Would you rather be attacked to your face or flattered to your face?

Probably flattered.

You're an honest man.

Oh, you know, attacked. It's like, you know, because you. We were talking about this last night about, you know, like, we can be in situations where you can't just have a normal conversation with somebody who disagrees with you. Right. A lot of times, it. That person's filming it or somebody else filming it, or they're shit talking to you and they want to get a reaction out of you. So those, you know, I don't shy away from those. And I don't. Those don't, like, get under my skin. Actually. I find those comical, but I'd much.

Rather, like when, at dinner, when you go out to restaurants?

No, not really. I think most people that I do say this, like, and I feel confident in this, like, the majority of people that want to censor me, cancel me, shame me, shit talk me. If they got to know me, I think, would have a different opinion of me. And I hear this from, actually, a lot of people were like, man, you're just so much different than I thought.

What do they think you're like?

Well, they get the image from mainstream media or from two disgruntled teammates that I'm some sort of, like, overly arrogant, narcissistic prick. And then when you get to know me, it's like, oh, you're not really any of those things that you've been painted as, because you have to have a villain, and you're the villain now because you stood up to the government and you're not bought and paid for and beholden to all these other things, and you're not quiet about your beliefs. So I think that's usually the common perception. And then the common reaction I hear from a lot of people, people who don't even actually agree with me or who thought about me a lot of times a certain way, often will say, man, I really enjoyed this time together, this dinner, this conversation. And you're different than I thought. I'm always like, thanks, I guess. Low expectations, you know, high deliverables.

I thought you were an asshole.

Yeah.

By the way, I'm sorry. I totally forgot this. Our producers put all this stuff. I haven't even looked at any of it. They found this, which just amused the hell out of me. Remember how they were saying ivermectin was horse dewormer? Pretty sure I took ivermectin.

Horse paste.

Horse paste. This actually is. It's horse based duramectin. Ivermectin paste for oral use in horses only, though it does look like rectal use.

Nice.

That's the ivermectin dispenser.

I love that.

I'm gonna keep that on the bar right behind you just to see if.

Let's see it. A little shot shadow box. There's a little box for it to put up on the wall. That'd be awesome.

So what do your teammates think of all this stuff?

Most of all, most of them are really interested. You know, we. I try and share a lot of my experiences, especially my failures as a young player, because I want to help these guys not make the same mistakes. So whether it's failure in hiring the wrong manager, agent, or financial people or just not be involved in my business as a young person person or some of these guys, you know, involve a lot of family members to handle, like, really important parts of their job. So just, like, sharing my experiences with those guys.

Don't hire your drunk cousin.

Yeah, like, you know, maybe keep family and business separate as much as you can. Unless, you know, your family member is, like, a certified, you know, accountant or something, lawyer or something, you trust them. Like, I think it's always best to kind of, you know, keep some distance between friendship and business, too. It's always. Can get a little bit dicey at times. I made many mistakes doing that and try and share those experiences with them. My life, you know, publicly. The things I talk about now, as we're shifting four years from three years, I guess, from COVID is more around plant medicine. So they're very interested in that, interested in ayahuasca and psilocybin and the effects and the fears. And they have a lot of the same fears that most people have around a bad trip, a bad journey, a bad time. And so it's fun to have those conversations. Many people reached out wanting to set up their own journeys, their own trips. Just learn more about it. I'm an avid reader as well. So there are people checking me about books to read and recommend, and so I love doing that with some of my teammates.

And so I might start them with the alchemist or with that one and maybe send them to a crack hour book or send them to a self help book or something, or maybe a book about medicine. But yeah, I just, we joked. There was a group of us in the corner of the locker room that we kind of called the brain trust. So we'd, the four of us start talking. You see, like, somebody come pull the chair up, another guy would come over and pull it, you know, like, next. You know, it was like ten guys just kind of listening what we're talking about. And guys are eager to learn, people from all different types of backgrounds and walks of life. And that's a lot of fun. But, you know, I think to be relatable to those guys, you gotta first share your failures, you know, share for sure, share, you know, the things you wish you'd done differently and, and it's like, I would guess it's like a parent where you don't want to save them from everything, but. But you like to stop them from making, you know, big mistakes that could really affect their life down the road.

Some, some lessons they gotta learn on their own. But there's some things that I've fucked up on that I love to share with the guys so they don't make the same mistakes that I did.

Are you going to miss it?

Yeah, for sure. I missed the guys, like, going to Derbys last weekend. The best part, and with all respect to the horses and Churchill downs and a lot of stuff, the real point of the trip is, is the camaraderie with the guys. And thats most guys I played with and a lot of guys I only see maybe once or twice a year. And this is kind of one of those events and, like, we just share stories and laugh about the same stuff and catch up on family and kids and, and injuries and body and health and the newest hacks that they're working on. One of our guys, you know, he was my center for a long time, Corey, and he played at like 305 pounds. Now he weighs 235. So, like, seeing him healthy is awesome. And talking to him about his life. He's got four kids now and a beautiful wife, and that's the fun part, is just seeing these guys once or twice a year and just like keeping that close bond.

Is it weird to be the last guy standing?

It is weird.

I mean, you're the last guy from your year right.

I'm the last guy from my year. I'm the last guy in that group. That's the big group that's playing. Devontae Adams was with us, and Devante still playing. It's going to his 10th season, but, yeah, like, all the guys that came in the league are gone. I, you know, like, long gone. Long gone. But I. And I transcend a lot of stuff. Like, we had dinner Saturday night, and a few of Simeon guys came over, and one of the guys was Ray Lewis's son, and. And just tell a kid who's not a kid, he's in his twenties, like, I played against your dad. That feels kind of weird.

Yeah, that is weird.

Yeah, it's crazy.

What's the truth about CTE?

The truth is our sport is dangerous.

Well, yeah, yeah.

The truth is our sport is dangerous. The truth is that there's minor brain injuries that happen every single game. I would assume there's collisions. It's a collision sport, and I think it's important that we really pay attention to how our bodies are responding. The league is in. The agreement with the players has gotten better. Every single collective bargaining agreement, which I think I've been a part of three now, where they've done a better job of taking care of older players. But back in the day, even when I was a young player, you get dinged in the head, hey, just let it clear, or you see stars. Oh, that's fine. Like, far, he talked about all the concussions that he had. He's had. He would never come out. He was just like, oh, you got dang machine stars. That's fine. Just like, let it pass and go back in there.

Have some more gatorade.

Yeah, about that, but I think we're doing a better job of safety in. The equipment's better, the helmets are better, the diagnosis are better.

Are people worried about it, do you think? Younger players?

I don't think. I don't think so. Not. Not many of them. I think more people are worried about their own health and some of the meds that are given out. Like, there was a med problem in the league for a while. Guys used to get. It was easy to get vicodins, percocets, that kind of stuff. Then there was an issue at one of the teams, and they kind of changed the policy, which is better now, but that was an issue. I think some of the addiction to some of that stuff that some of my teammates had.

Do you remember that time?

Yeah, I remember a teammate of mine who was so addicted to Percocet that he had to be put under anesthesia to have his surgically repaired knee moved. That was wild. And that was not abnormal. There were a lot of people that were.

Why? Because it dulled his.

Yes. His pain tolerance. Just like he had, you know, he had to give so many meds to, like, be able to, to be moved. It was wild.

Did he recover?

Not really. I mean, he has. He since has now, and he's. And he's doing, he's doing really good. He's been sober for a while, but. But that's an issue. There's a, there's a. There's a really bad stat that they used to. It was a scare tactic, but it's true. Back in the day, it said that within three years, 75% of NFL players, uh, uh, three years post retirement will be broke, uh, divorced or unemployed. Um, and a lot of times it's multiple of those three. And I see it a lot because you're living this life. You're making a ton of money. Uh, that money train dries up. Uh, you maybe don't have a ton of life skills or haven't spent time in the league, like, planning for your post career stuff, or don't have the money to just, like, coast like I could, and some of the people who play long time could. And then, you know, there's marital issues that, you know, that happen, and it's a very sad statistic. The league tries to do some things to kind of promote second career stuff and financial literacy, but a lot of it's on the guys to learn on their own.

And if you don't have the right people advising you, it's, you know, I've seen a lot of my former friends, you know, go through some crises in their twenties because the average career is three years now. You're, you know, you're 26, 27, you have no job. You may or may not have graduated from college, but who knows how many people actually lose? Use the degree now anyway, from college. I mean, college is ridiculous. Yeah, it's, you know, but you've no.

Skills other than the game.

Yeah. And now they're trying to figure out what to do. So it's pretty.

And they got married to the wrong person along the way, possibly.

Yeah. Or just like, you know, 50% of marriages at this point or more, and in divorce anyway. So when the, you know, who knows? I mean, there's not blaming, not wife shaming here. There's.

No, no, I get it. I get it. But, I mean, it's, again, back to the fame question, if a woman is coming at you because you're famous, that's not a good basis for a marriage.

No. No, it's not. And, you know, there's some guys who haven't made some rough decisions, too, with having kids and multiple women. And some of those were bad decisions by the men. Some of those are women who saw a millionaire football player and wanted to be taken care of for a while. Both of those are true. Um, so sometimes that is something you take with you in the game where you. Now, you have a couple, you know, kids out there that you're taking care of for many years, and you don't have the same type of money coming in. So now there's financial issues with some of the, you know, child support that you should and. And do pay. So, guys, there's a lot of mistakes that are made, and some you can rectify and get through, and some, you know, make. Make life a little more difficult if you're not able to play, like, me, 20 years, and. And don't have any financial issues or any kid issues or any stuff like that.

You said that you started to realize that a lot of what we take for granted is actually untrue. And some of this. By this, I mean, our civilization is built on lies.

Yep.

You started to figure that out in high school. What do you think? But you also said you're in favor of just disclosing, like, the government should tell everything it knows if it did, that if we actually learned the truth about everything, various wars that we've had, assassinations that we've had, our economy, like, what would happen? The government. Things would fall apart. People would just be so overwhelmed and so disgusted that they wouldn't believe in the government. They would, I don't know, become nihilists or something. Like, what do you think would happen if we actually knew the truth about everything?

I don't think that's the worst thing. I mean, if you're making decisions based on what's the worst that could happen in this case, I think there'd be a ton of people actually connecting and finding common ground because it'd be a common enemy. You know, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

That's right.

Right. And I think it'd be fascinating to watch the structures we put so much trust in just crumble. And I think a lot of that needs to happen, whether that's in one disclosure, one fell swoop, or over the years. It is kind of wild, though, that we still can't release the JFK files. And we're. That happened 1963. We're 60, what, 61 years. This November, Pfizer tried to release their files in 75 years initially. That's what they asked. You know, they're testing stuff. 75 years. They want it. Disclosure on the UFO stuff was supposed to happen many times. Right.

Trump most recently last year.

Trump supposedly saw it and then decided not to release it. Right. Or was that the JFK stuff he was talking about? Both. Yeah. And Biden is. Everything's gotten pushed back. I don't know. I think in order for us to, to advance the society, there has to be, in this age of Aquarius, there has to be disclosure. I mean, for you, you had to be privy, living in Washington, working for Fox, being the top guy there. Stuff that not everybody knows, and you probably know more than the common person, but how much did you encounter? You don't have to get specific. Is stuff that you don't think the american public could handle, that you know, or that you believe.

I mean, I agree with you 100%. And I thought that was so nicely put and so smart that if you knew the truth, your belief in lies, of course, would evaporate. You'd no longer believe the liars, and that's not a bad thing, but that you would be united much more than we are now with your fellow Americans. And I think that's a really, that's a wonderful way to look at it. I think that's absolutely right.

Yeah. I said enemy of my enemy. But it's like, I'm not enemies with, you know, a Democrat or Republican. I'm not enemies with somebody that has different skin color.

I think of that about, they put.

Us against each other. Of course they want to divide it.

You know, if you watch the media, I've thought of this a couple of years ago. They're always calling me racist, white supremacist. Never bothered me that much because I'm not.

You're a Putin apologist.

I didn't care at all about that, but I didn't really want to be called a racist because that's awful. You know, it's awful to be a racist. So, um. But then it stopped bothering me. But I was left with the feeling, man, there's a lot of racial tension in this country, and there's clearly some. But I gotta tell you, in the last, I don't know, ten years, I've never, I've not had one black person confront me about being racist. Not one, not a single time. And I've also not heard people, like, angry about race and my personal life. Maybe it's just me. I think there's a lot less race hate than we're told there is, much less. I think most people kind of get along with each other, actually, in this country. I believe that. And it's very clear to me that they're doing this on purpose, the people in charge, in order to keep us divided and angry and confused. So I agree with you that disclosure would have that effect. In my specific case, I feel like I've learned probably too much about a couple of topics, because, by the way, there's some things that I can't prove that I believe to be true, so I don't repeat them.

But the UAP stuff, some of it is really distressing to me, what I believe to be true, but I can't prove it. But as I've said before, I think it's spiritual. I think some of these things are dark, anti human. Probably some aren't.

But, you know, do you think because there's potential anti human properties that there's actually pro human supernatural?

Well, I think God's. I think God's real for sure. And as evil flourishes, you also see it's obverse. You see good at work. You see God at work. I do in my life all the time. In a way that I didn't say five years ago. I wasn't thinking like that at all. A very secular person who grew up in a very secular world, unlike you, I did not grow up in any recognizable church at all. And so I had none of those assumptions. But, no, I think it's, in bad times like this one, there are miraculous and heartening moments, and I see that all the time. If we learned everything that the government is hiding from us, what would you be most interested in learning about?

Well, I mean, JFK for sure. Yeah, I want to. I want to see those files, because that's what got me into it. But I think the UAP thing.

Would you be shocked to learn that Jeffrey Epstein didn't kill himself?

No. I mean, how many. How many Jeffrey Epstein type people are out there?

Well, that's right.

That's the real question.

You mean people who've been killed? Who've been killed, or people who are using sex as a blackmail tool?

That.

Yep.

And then who's pulling the strings on that?

Any guesses?

Ghislaine Maxwell has a lot of ties to the Mossad.

Yep.

That would make sense. I mean, Jeffrey didn't seem to get some of the appointments he was given in the prominence based on merit somebody was putting them in the right spots, but I don't think he's the only one. I think there's a problem, a weird, bizarre problem, really, that has a weird sex component to it with some of the elites, and there's a pedophile component to it as well, which is really sick. And there's some prominent figures who are in the spotlight as of. As of late. I just. I would like that to be. To be exposed. But Jeffrey Epstein had the goods on everybody. There were a lot of people that didn't want him to be alive. And then the whole, you know, wild story around, you know, multiple people being sleep and, you know, him not being watched at the time is real convenient. And I just don't believe in that many coincidences.

No, no, no. He was. He. He was murdered in federal detention in Manhattan. I don't think there's any question about that. And people lied about it, including the then attorney general of the United States.

I think there's some weird correlations between the. And anomalies that, you know, the Johnny Depp trial had eyes on it. Crazy coverage, and the Ghislaine Maxwell trial had next to no coverage, no tv coverage, no comment, no nightly commentary about it, no traffic to nobody. I mean, they literally got. She is indicted for trafficking kids, and nobody who she was trafficking kids to kind of dictate it or named. Yeah, and all the files that are out there haven't. Still haven't been released. We have one testimony from one victim. That's all we have when that came out, just literally like, one victim. And there's hundreds of, just in that little. Who flew on the Lolita express. And there's a lot of super prominent names who are on the flight logs.

What's the sex thing about? I mean, you've been in famous guy world for a long time, and you're from, like, me, you're from California, so obviously you've been around well known cultural figures, the elites. Have you, how long have you thought this, that sex plays a role?

Well, not that long. I mean, I've just kind of, you know, I've seen some interesting things. I bet you have been around some interesting parties and gatherings that are strange. Not anything like what it sounds like, you know, a diddy party, but just even at, you know, an Oscar party, just seeing how some of these people act was always very little bit strange. I just never resonated with. It was almost like interesting people watching, but there always seemed like there was parties within the party. People kind of doing their own thing that always kind of weird me out a little bit, but. But getting into conspiracy stuff, then you know, about secret society stuff and, like. Stuff like the bohemian grove.

Yes.

And you know what Nixon said about the grove, and what did he say? He. Well, you have to go look at his quote. His quote is not exactly. You know, there's some.

They're all gay, right? Something like that.

What he said. Yeah. And the secrecy around that. And there's. That's not the only secret society. There's a lot of really interesting secret societies, not just like the skull and bones at Yale, which has produced all those presidents and the Freemasonry at its highest level. And there is a sexual component, I think, to a lot of that. Obviously, with Epstein, it was blackmail to get them to do what they want. I mean, how many people are compromised by that, that are in positions of power today? I think you're naive to think it's none. And you said it on the podcast with Joe. The scary part for those people is that. And for us, you know, is they could, you know, put some on your computer to cancel you. They could set you up for something.

Oh, of course.

Thankfully. Me, I've. I don't watch porn. You know, I've never been into any weird, kinky stuff, so it'd be really. You know.

And it could be pretty unwise for a prominent person to get into online porn because all that stuff is monitored. I mean. What.

Yeah, but I think a lot of those people probably are.

You'd have to be an idiot. There's a. There's a camera on your phone and your iPad and your laptop.

Yeah, yeah, but, I mean, didn't. You know. Again, there's weird anomalies with everything but the. You know, it gets used all the time. Right? Like, stuff like that gets used all the time to silence people, to quiet people. Now, whether that's legitimate or not. If it's legitimate, that's fucking sick and gross. And those people should be. If it's illegitimate, not real, and it's been planted, like, that's fucking shitty, shit sandwiched.

Well, kiddie porn. I always. I always try and say it out loud just to indemnify myself, to protect myself against. I don't. I don't have a laptop. Not into porn or kitty porn. I just want to say that out loud.

Yeah. I'm gonna say the same thing. You do feel like never been into it.

Whenever someone.

I wouldn't kill myself. I love my life.

If you can spend five nights with darkness, I think you're psychologically pretty healthy. Like, you're. You're beating the averages on that. I feel like I'm pretty psychologically healthy, and I could not do that. But if you found out everything you said, faith in government would collapse completely.

Yes.

And that's a good thing. But would. Would that be, like the road to anarchy? At that point.

I think you might need some of that. Anarchy, I think, is always seen. You have to look up and give me the exact definition of anarchy. But the thought of anarchy is just like chaos.

Yes, chaos.

But it's more just a. I believe it's more like a belief in the. It's a doubt in the government's ability to do its job.

Yes.

At its core.

Well, I qualify then.

Yeah. I'm not going to call you an anarchist, but we need some of that. We need some more questioning. We need more disclosure. We need more things being brought out to light. We need more journalists doing their job and having the right conversations. I'm excited for you to. I can't even imagine who you're going to get on your podcast, because it's going to be amazing.

You're the first one, and I'm grateful. Just two more questions.

And then I have one at the end, too.

So the first one is, I asked you what you're gonna do when you retire, which is probably imminent just at some point, just because of your age and your amazing longevity so far in the sport. But you said you just want to take a deep breath. Could you see yourself running for office?

No. No, I don't think so. No, I just. I don't. I believe in Bobby. And. And what do you stand up for? But I've never been super into politics, and as said publicly, I believe it's a sham. Now, I retract that in the context of Bobby because I believe in what he stands for. But I've never felt like there's been two parties. It's just been the same people. And the bombs still get dropped, regardless of whether it's Trump or Obama or Bush or Clinton. War still get fought, taxes still get levied. Evil and corruption still exists. Secret handshake society still exists. The lobbyist power still exists. All the big whatever military industrial complex still exists, no matter who's in charge. So how much can you actually impact? I don't know. I mean, I like to think that if Bobby got in, if they didn't take him out, that he could enact some real change. I think the Alphabet groups need a full makeover, and if we're going to, you know, support espionage, then let's make sure we're not doing it. Our own people who are good, you know, self, you know, conscientious, freedom loving Americans, Republican, Democrat, independent, black, white, asian, mexican, whatever it is.

That's right.

Just great fucking people who live in this country. Leave us alone. Leave us alone.

Yeah, stop spying on me.

Yeah, get off my computer. Get off my cameras. Get off my ring camera. You know, take down all this stupid fucking cctv cameras everywhere that are watching everything. And because the next step to all of this, if people don't realize this, and this is the fucking facts, is China and what's going on there and social credit scores and entire life monitored. Like, that's where we're going. Slowly. Jordan Peterson said was doing an interview and talked about how does. I can't remember what the conversation was, but I heard him say this. How does corruption take form when it's so obvious it's slow movements. It's like barely inching towards total corruption and obedience where you don't really see it coming. Next thing you know, oh, I have no other option but to get a chip in my hand or have a social credit score that allows me to fly on a plane. If I don't have a good one, then I got to ride on a bus or a train or a cab or I can drive. They want all electric cars. I can just shut that off at some point because your post on Facebook violated the government standard here.

Also, we're going to freeze your bank account or only let you, you know, eat at this restaurant. Sorry. Eat it. You know, get groceries from this store. Not like the nice, you know, organic store. You don't have to eat this shit over here. Eat insects or whatever the hell.

The Oreo store.

Yeah, we're not far from that. If we don't like, stand for. For civil liberties. And people always like, you know, when I talk about. Because I'm always been a big proponent of Ed Snowden and people like, well, I have nothing to hide. And I'm like, that is the fucking worst answer because I don't have anything to hide either, but I want my privacy. And you don't understand. You think the government is going to stop at what they're doing now? They're not going to stop with this. They're inching closer to being 1984. Will they have a set in your, some sort of tv set in your house that watches you make sure you get up and do your ten push ups, ten sit ups to watch every aspect of your life? We're going to give you a social credit score. We're going to create. I mean, it's a fucking great book to read. It was written in 1949 and how many, how accurate it is today. Literally a ministry of truth. We literally had a government organization that was censoring free speech and categorizing things as misinformation. There was a ministry of truth czar who was making decisions based on what they thought was acceptable language online and all these fact checking bullshit.

Like, we're not far from 1949 from that book 1984, which was written in 1949, if we don't take a stand for our civil liberties. And that's why I think that there needs to be more disclosure. I hope there is. I hope there's more corruption. I hope Bobby gets a chance to debate because I think he'd do a hell of a job. I hope Nicole gets a chance to debate against Kamala Harris because I think that'd be a big win for her.

Have you met her?

No, I haven't. I enjoy what she says.

My last question is, we are moving there and no one is stopping it at this. As of today, may 2024. So where are we in five years?

I was a little bit worried coming out of COVID because I saw so many people who were manipulated by fear and laid down and followed the rules. I think it was a lot of people who are captivated by fear, for sure, but the majority was conscientious, good hearted Americans.

That's right.

I really do believe that. Who just wanted to do what they thought was right.

Exactly.

Trusting that the government wouldn't lie to them, wouldn't fuck with them. And I think those people are waking up. That's why I have hope. I really do have hope that we've learned our lesson and that the powers that be, the evil, unseen world, overstepped a little bit too far and that they got power hungry and they got a little over their skis, and the people woke up and are not going to allow this to happen again. And there's some weird things going on in the world right now. The stuff of the border is very weird, like listening to Brett Weinstein talk on Rogan about the groups of chinese military age men that are getting in is very unnerving and they're doing it in new ways. And we're not prosecuting anybody in a lot of these big cities. And there's the George Soros of the world who are anti human and funding a lot of these protests, probably on these college campuses as they're arresting people who don't have student ids, who aren't a part of it. We saw it in Wisconsin when there was riots going on. They were bossing people in from Illinois and Iowa, all these different places.

So there's anti human people out there who don't want this to happen. But I think there's so many incredible, good hearted, conscientious Americans, both Republican, Democrat, independent, undecided, don't give a shit about politics, obsess over C SPAN every day or whatever it might be, who are just waking up and going, you know what? This is not the America that, you know, my ancestors fought for, that I want to be a part of that. It was when I was a kid, when I was in high school, when I was in college, whatever it might be, and they're not going to put up with it much longer. And I think that that's what I'm saying. I think the evil kind of overstepped a little bit too far. And now that the tides are turning.

I hope you're right. I hope we look back and see.

COVID as a blessing to cut you up. This is the other part of it is where do we get our media from these days? Like the information police, who forever growing up, not me, but like, the Walter Cronkites of the world who are idolized as, like, the Dan rather who, like, it seemed like there was someone you could trust who was giving you the truth on tv. Yes, those days are gone. And thankfully, X has some level of freedom of speech still. But media, our media, we get from, majority of us, from Twitter, not from Fox or CNN.

True.

Right, you had a huge following, but then you go to X and your numbers go fucking crazy. Yeah, but the majority, how we're gonna change the world, I think, is by having conversations like this. They're not just me. I'm just some, you know, some anti vaxxer, you know, you know, football player conspiracy theorists. Yeah, but with Joe, I mean, the most. The most influential people in the world, right? Joe Rogan's one of them.

Yeah.

Joe has ten plus million listened to everyone. His podcast, every single podcast that he does goes immediately to number one on Spotify.

Oh, yeah.

Yourself, the numbers you got impressions you got, the views you got when you did interviews with Trump and Putin and everybody in between were astronomical. Nobody's ever seen. And it's going to be. What gives me hope is that you have our voice of reason. You are willing to stand up what you believe in, and that, you know, guys like Joe and yourself and countless others are willing to, like, lay their reputation aside, get canceled for standing up for what they believe is right. And that's the way that we change things. So that's why I fucking am a huge fan of yours and just want to encourage you, if I can to just like fucking keep doing what you're doing. Because this is how the world changes. By having long form conversation with interesting people who can change the narrative and get people to go, you know what? Maybe I can change my opinion because that's the only way that we grow together is by talking to people that we don't actually agree on everything or we have a, what we think is a tightly held belief. And we go, you know what? I'm gonna loosen that grip a little bit and just listen to what somebody else has to say.

And then maybe there's something in there that goes, I like that. I might, I might not have to hold so firmly to this anymore. And it's just like in the church, right? And you're a spiritual person. I'm a spiritual person talking about aliens. You can't talk about that shit in church, right? No, there's no other. God created Adam and Eve and just on this planet, right? There's no. Nothing else to look at. Well, there's some weird, you know, extraterrestrial references in the Bible that they didn't have maybe the words for. But there could be some other shit going on here. And maybe I shouldn't hold so tightly to that one belief that I'm the only thing on this entire earth and the earth is 5000 years old and there's nothing else going on here. Like, we all need to transgress, to transcend, sorry, our beliefs to include the stuff that we want. But in order for us to get to the next level whether that's the next dimension, a new earth, a new way of living is to transcend and include what we believe. And in doing that, I think it's talking to people that we don't necessarily agree with.

It's like what I'm trying to do and will continue to try and do and that's have empathy and compassion for people that have slandered me, shame me and cancel me. Try to and get past that.

That's the most christian possible thing you could do. I mean, christians are commanded to do that. They don't, but they, they're commanded to do that. Pray for those who persecute you, love your enemies. I mean, that's.

And like, sincerely do it. I'm gonna. I mean, sincerely try and. Try and do that. And I think we can all do that on some level. But it starts with just, like, just opening your heart a little bit, trying to love people a little bit better, trying to love yourself a little bit better, and then not being scared to stand up for what you believe in.

It feels like there's a depth of conversation. This is my last question, but have you noticed in your personal life that the conversations you're having with the people you love who are friends, who you're friends with, that they're much deeper than they were five years ago?

Much, much deeper? Yeah, I think there's a number of reasons for that. It's just where I'm at personally, the changes I've tried to make. But I think in general, people are desperate for that deep connection, and they're just tired of surface level stuff, and they. And they really want to go deep. And we attract our tribe, you know, your vibe attracts your attraction tribe. And just like you said, I don't really know anybody who's, like, you know, vaxxed or wearing a mask in cars. I don't really either. And there's no judgment. There's no judgment.

I'm not judging. It's just interesting.

That's just where you're at on your journey. That's awesome. That's great. You know, like, I wish you didn't have that much fear, but, like, mad love, you know, whatever you're doing. But, like, the people that I'm trying to attract and that I have been is just people who are desperate for, like, depth and connection and finding, like, common ground. Even the people that I don't. I had dinos people recently that are, you know, fully vaccine and double boosted, and we had a beautiful conversation about, you know, a dozen different topics I left going, fuck, that's awesome. Like, I love being able to connect with people like that who don't have a base level of, like, yes, belief that I do. But the. But we both came to a table, like, in the actual table, like, wanting to have, like, a deep conversation and to understand each other better. And I think that's how we move this thing forward, and that's my life is just, like, people who want to go deep. And whether it's on medicine or off medicine or talking about medicine or not talking about medicine, it's all, you know, it's all like, how can we connect deeper?

How can we love better? How can we love ourselves and our world and actually make a difference? And that's why, you know, guys like yourself, guys like Joe, are making a difference because they're platforming people who really care about this life and are doing awesome things. And when you hear somebody who's passionate about something, it just gets you like kind of vitalized about life and you're like, oh, fuck yeah. Like these people do love America and they do want to make a difference and they do, you know, care about right and wrong. And there is a field of value where things are good and things are evil and standing up for what's good. And that's, that's what you're doing. That's what you did on Fox for all those years. That's what you did when you fucking left Fox. And I'm just glad to know you. Glad to be friends.

I am too. Thank you, Aaron Rodgers and thank you for dinner. That was great.

Thank you.

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