This show is presented by the Commonwealth Fund, a nonprofit foundation whose mission is to promote a high performing, equitable healthcare system. The Commonwealth Fund supports research to improve healthcare policy and practice and has a long history of exploring what the US can learn from the best healthcare around the world to do better here at home, especially for people of color, people with low income, and those who are uninsured. To learn more, visit commonwealthfund.org dot.

Comedian Sam Bee has made a lot of choices in her life, joining the Daily show, creating full frontal, and choosing to win a few emmys in the process. You could say she's pro choice. Yes, that choice, but also other choices. She's a supporter of people making life changing decisions that can lead them down a new path that can often lead to many other paths. On Lemonade Media's new podcast, Choice Words, Sam Bee will interview celebrities, politicians, and people she admires about the biggest decisions they've made in their lives. Together, they'll get into the gratitude or regret that accompanies each of their decisions and look at how that one moment impacted their life. Today. Choice words is out now, wherever you get your podcasts.

Lemonade, navigating the ins.

And outs of assisted living and independent living and rehab and skilled nursing. And what does a hospital stay look like? Oh my God. It is a nightmare.

We are all that my mom has, so there's really no other alternative. But I also want to give her the life that she deserves. So I'm constantly navigating this fine line between how much autonomy to give my father while also keeping him safe. I'm a single mom. I also work a father full time job. I'm a preschool teacher. And the juggling of all these things is just overwhelming, to say the least. Overwhelming. No other alternative. A nightmare. Being a family caregiver while navigating our country's incoherent long term care system can be all of these things without adequate support. The roughly 42 million unpaid caregivers in the US who care for older loved ones are often in possible situations. This is uncared for. I'm your host, Sujin park. Welcome to season two. Well, back when we were recording the first season of our podcast around maternal health care, I was going through a family crisis off mic. My dad was going into a huge surgery and taking care of both him, my mom, and on top of it, dealing with all the complications around his health. Well, let's just say it was a pretty dark time.

But from that experience, we're here today talking about a subject that I am deeply passionate about something that I'm grappling with in real time every day. How do we take care of our elderly loved ones? How do we find support? How do we manage the huge burden and still figure out how to live our lives as well? More than one in five Americans are taking care of loved ones, and that number is only going to increase as our population gets older. And if you're in this boat caring for a loved one like your mom or dad, you want the best care that's out there. But what does that care cost? And who pays for it? From the cost of prescriptions to medical equipment to home health aides, elder care is expensive. So expensive, even Amy Goyer, a caregiving expert for AARP, struggled financially to give her parents the best care possible.

I was paying the mortgage. I was paying for all the utilities. I was paying for all the food, the exercise, his service dog, everything. And during that five years was, you just would not believe how quickly that debt can multiply.

Amy completely depleted her savings, went into debt and, seeing no other options, filed for bankruptcy. My conversation with her about finances, caregiving, and just the level of commitment it takes was a game changer for me and a perfect place to start this new season. Amy is literally AARP's caregiving expert and was the primary caregiver for her father, who passed in 2018. And still, with all of this experience, Amy could not overcome the systemic issues that make it so difficult for family caregivers to make ends meet. Not only are family caregivers providing unpaid care, they spend, on average, a quarter of their annual income taking care of their loved ones. All of this can mean financial risk to the caregiver. And Amy Goyer. Our guest today had to learn this the hard way. So let's talk about your personal journey first. You've been a caregiver in various roles throughout your life, but can you talk me through that, like, how that started and then sort of progressed as you got older?

So I'm the youngest of four girls, and I was the only one who wasn't married, didn't have a family. So that might have been part of, and it was also because I was working in the field. So, you know, caregiving is kind of across a spectrum. And I have had different types of roles for every family member. So I did a lot of arranging for care for my grandparents. I just started kind of falling into the role of driving six and a half hours and going and checking on them, getting them home, health aides, setting them up for meals on wheels. I remember teaching my grandfather, how to deal with my grandmother's incontinence. He had put plastic bags on the bed at night. He didn't. He didn't know there were supplies you could get. And so just trying to coach him and help him with that. And then I also tried to bring them quality of life, you know, as caregivers, that's equally important. And so I put up the Christmas tree or go out to eat with them. And, you know, I certainly didn't get over there as often as I would have liked, but I went pretty often and very much increasingly as.

As they got older, towards the end of their life, as her grandparents were.

Approaching their end of life, Amy's mom had a major stroke at 62. Amy's dad, who'd been the primary caregiver for his parents, took on the care of his wife while also working a demanding job. At the time, Amy was working at AARP in Washington, DC, and she was traveling back to Arizona to help her parents. Then Amy's dad's health started declining.

My dad started showing some symptoms and was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. He was on some medication, and they were still independent for quite a few years, really. He could still drive. He could still do things, but I just started helping him with more complicated financial matters. He would have trouble getting organized. That was one of the first things I saw. And he would have hard time managing my mom's health because mom's health was decreased. She was having falls and various hospitalizations, and so I would fly out and try and help, and, you know, it just gradually, gradually increasing support from my dad because I didn't want to take away his independence. I wanted him to keep doing everything he could do as long as he could do it, because I know that was good for his brain and that was good for his self esteem and everything, his mental health. There came a point where he really struggled. Mom had a hospitalization, and he was struggling with getting a little bit lost in the hospital. And that was scary for us. And the other piece of it was that we wanted him to stop driving, and that's a game changer for everyone.

He had glaucoma, so he had some visual issues. But we later learned that the Alzheimer's was actually affecting his visual processing as well. So we had seen a lot of dents and dings on the car. And so when we asked him to stop driving, he was angry at first, and then he said, we're not staying in this house. We don't want to be stuck here. So they moved into the senior community that was only 2 miles from their house. And I moved across the country and moved into their house because at this point, I knew they needed me.

Take me back to that moment when you're deciding, okay, I have to move. I have to take a real. I mean, a major pivot. It may not felt that way to you in the beginning, I'm not sure, but I'm just. I kind of take, like, did that decision come easy to you? Was that, you know, what were some of the things that you were thinking about as you were thinking, okay, what is the best for me, for my folks? I kind of want to go back there just for a moment.

I quit my job first to have more flexibility, and I became a consultant, which, you know, that has its pros and cons because I don't have benefits and all of the things that you get when you're a full time employee. But I had the flexibility I needed to work from anywhere. And for the first six months, I went out to Arizona and I would work from there for a couple weeks, a month, come back, be in DC for a couple weeks, a month. And I thought that was going to work. And what I just kept seeing was, in fact, honestly, I remember one time leaving to come back to DC, and my dad cried. And I'll tell you what, my dad was not a crier. I probably saw him cried four times in my whole life.

None of our dads are.

No, exactly. And, yeah, and he's, you know, he was a world war two veteran and korean war veteran, and he was the professor, and he cried when I left, and I'll never forget that. And I just thought, he needs me, they need me, and I can do this, so how can I do this and keep working and have my life? And I just thought, how can I piece this together? And honestly, it was like jumping off a cliff, in a sense, when I really made that switch to move. And by the way, I left my boyfriend back in the DC. He lived in Baltimore. And so our relationship had been kind of long distance for about two and a half years, and then it became very long distance. It's complicated to adjust your life.

So your parents were in this facility and you were living in their home to be nearby, going back and forth, working that job, your boyfriends across the country. How did the caregiving shift for you in that moment?

I was able to kind of keep one leg in my previous life because of work, you know, bringing me back to DC. So I tried to keep all the balls in the air, I guess and to balance it, and there's no real balancing, you know, I mean, you're going to sacrifice some things, but I had wonderful parents. My motivator is love. Many caregivers don't have that, and they're doing it out of responsibility or duty. For me, that was, you know, I wasn't going to let my parents suffer. I wasn't going to let them, you know, be in a facility with no one looking out for them or anything like that. So I wanted to support every aspect of their life.

And Amy truly means that she would come to support emotionally and financially almost every part of their lives. After this short break, we'll hear about Amy's next phase of caregiving for her parents, moving them back home to live with her, and the moment Amy files for bankruptcy. Voices matter. Stories create change, and perspectives are powerful. That's what the team at the Commonwealth Fund believes, and it's why they make space for the stories of people who have been affected by the inequities in our healthcare system and for the voices of those working to root out racism in health care. They're advancing health equity. Instagram account shares news, lifts perspectives, and publishes data on the state of health equity in the US. Follow them on Instagram. Advancinghealthequity to keep a pulse on one of the most important issues at hand right now.

Hola, amigos. It's chef Jose Andres. I am a cook and someone that passionately believes complex problems often have very simple solutions, like sitting down together and sharing our stories. Now guess what? I have a podcast, longer tables, where I do just that. Each episode features brilliant people like Stacey Abrams, Ron Howard, and Jane Goodall talking about food, life, and everything in between. Listen to longer tables, whatever you get. Podcasts.

We're back. Amy's parents health was declining. Her mother had had a stroke, and her dad was diagnosed with Alzheimer's. But instead of moving them to a more costly assisted living facility, Amy decided to move them back into their home with her. I know a lot of you listening can probably relate to this. Maybe you've made a similar decision after crunching all the numbers. And speaking of numbers. So let's just pause and get into it for a sec. The US does a lousy job of caring for our elders. Our country has no system of long term care. Instead, about 42 million Americans provide unpaid care to older loved ones. According to AARP, the value of family caregivers in this country is 600 billion. If we were being paid $600 billion worth of care, and that's a conservative estimate. Unpaid family caregivers are the foundation of America's long term care system, and Amy's experience couldn't make that more obvious. While she was juggling work and other family responsibilities, Amy became her parents live in family caregiver. And with this big change came financial challenges that Amy didn't quite expect.

I was paying the mortgage. I was paying for all the utilities. I was paying for all the food. I was paying for anything. But here we were hiring caregivers, you know, so I had a living caregiver in the beginning, and then I had different living caregivers over the. Over the years, and my sister from Ohio ended up coming and helping out when I had to go out of town for my work. But I would pay for her flight to come out, and I had to rent an office because I had been working from home, and there was no safe place in that house anymore where I could have the quiet to do my work.

Yeah.

And so those expenses went up, whereas my parents, they had just enough money in their budget with dad's retirement and both of their Social Security and both of their long term care insurance to pay the caregivers.

And that's it.

That basically, I paid for everything else.

Yeah. And this is with, you know, your father, your parents preparing for retirement, like, you know, putting away, because that's. I would say that's not the majority of the case. Even with that, they really needed so much more. And so you took on just all the costs of living for the three of you, plus caring for them. Was there a moment when you started to feel like, uh, oh, yes, this is ballooning so out of my control?

Yes. Because I ended up starting to use credit cards to get through the month, every month.

Yeah.

And then that credit card debt started building up, and I would have spreadsheets trying to keep track of it all.

At this point, Amy is covering her own expenses and her parents expenses. She was racking up credit card debt, which she tried to manage on her own. Amy's parents each had Social Security and long term care insurance. And if you're not familiar with the latter, that makes complete sense. Only around 3% of Americans actually have long term care insurance, which may provide coverage for home health aides, adult day care, and nursing home care, basically things usually not covered by Medicare. At this point, Amy is covering her own expenses and her parents expenses. She was racking up credit card debt, which she tried to manage on her own. They also had her dad's pension and VA benefits. This patchwork of income paid for the professional caregivers. But as Amy explains, some of that income would go away when her mom died in 2013, leaving Amy to take on even more costs.

My mom passed away very suddenly about a year after they moved in with me. And it was, you know, obviously emotionally and devastating for me and my sisters and devastating for dad and. But financially, her lost her Social Security and her long term care insurance, and those had been helping pay for the caregivers, but we had one caregiver helping both of them.

Yeah.

So basically, we lost that amount of money that was paying for those caregivers, but we still needed the caregiver.

Yeah, you can't split that in half. Right. You know?

Right, exactly.

Yeah.

So, so that's when things really changed. We were making it, but when, after mom died was when I started taking on more and more of the expensive and trying to make up and just, you know, chasing it. And dad lived with me for five more years, and during that five years was, you just would not believe how quickly that debt can multiply. Like, I have all these spreadsheets, and I've gone back and I've looked and I'm like, okay, here is my total debt here, and here's my total debt three months later or six months later, and it's just multiplying because of the high interest rates and the more debt you have, then they raise your interest rates. And I was so into the healthcare and the day to day and the quality of life and trying to take care of myself and do my work and take care of everybody else.

Everybody else included her older sister, who was living with a chronic disease. Amy flew back and forth between Maryland and Arizona to help take care of her. When her sister died, Amy was her estate manager and wasnt able to recoup the costs of that responsibility. She doesnt regret what she did for her sister, but its part of the full picture of her financial struggles at the time. And the expenses Amy paid related to her dads day to day living kept adding up.

I was paying for, you know, everything from medical equipment to clothing to a special diet or special, you know, natural things that I wanted dad to have. Dad had acupuncture, and it really, really helped his anxiety from the Alzheimer's. You know, that's one of the biggest problems in taking care of someone with Alzheimer's as it progresses is the behaviors, and it made a huge difference. And so I'm paying for that, you know, but that was, to me, that was a game changer. It was not an option not to do that. And so I will defend everything I chose to do for my dad, you know, till the day I die. The exercise, the. His service dog, everything. So as dad's life went on and everything, you know, the debt was just getting so high, you know, and I was trying to reach out to credit counseling and various different things and. But, you know, when you are in a caregiving situation with someone who's in their later stages of Alzheimer's, it's constant.

These are expenses that you're like, you're not talking hundreds of dollars. It's like owning a house, you know, like, I remember the first time I own a house. I was like, how am I in the 5000 category here? Why is everything in those increments? And as I'm taking care of my parents, I mean, there are no small numbers when you're dealing with caregiving. I think anyone in any role of caregiving understands that so deeply that, like, this is an expensive role to take.

On was so hard, and especially because I am an expert in this field, but I'm not a financial expert. And I did so much and worked so hard to take care of myself in other ways and somehow neglected that. So when dad passed, daddy was 94 when he died. I was, you know, already desperately trying to get this figured out. And I met with accountants, lawyers, financial advisors, multiple people, every single one said, you need to go through bankruptcy. You're never going to get your way out of this. And I'm an intelligent person. I've worked in this field my whole life, and I maximized any benefits my parents could get. I did everything I could, you know, and so I don't feel badly about that. But going through bankruptcy was horrible and humiliating, and I did that after dad died.

Amy's dad died in 2018. That year, her credit card debt surpassed $120,000. Much of that amount was high. Interest rates on unpaid balances. Amy filed for bankruptcy the next year. Okay, so you meet with all these people and they say, okay, listen, you have to file for bankruptcy. What was your reaction? How did you move through that?

Well, and remember, I'm grieving at this point. My life has been so focused on caregiving. And when you have multiple losses and you're still caregiving, you often don't really process that other grief very well. So when my dad died, you know, my sisters and I just crashed. We were just. It was so hard. And, you know, my dad was a wonderful person, so we missed him. Even in the advanced stages of Alzheimer's, we missed him. But it had also been like my whole life, you make your life make sense with what you've got ahead of you. And so you're taking care of your parents, you're going to figure that out with your work and your family and your, all of your things. And then all of a sudden it kind of all blows up and you, you're trying to get your bearing. I described it as feeling untethered. You know, you're just in free fall, or, and you're, you have to kind of get your whole mindset flipped around like a. I talk about it as an ocean barge. You know, this is what was in my head was like a big, huge barge on the ocean.

And then all of a sudden it's told to turn around, and that thing doesn't turn quickly. It has to go really slowly and inch around, you know? And that's in my mind, like, I had to kind of grasp this whole thing, okay? Now my life is different, and I have to figure this out, you know? And so that's where I think on top of the grief, the emotional aspect of going through bankruptcy was, was so hard because they look at everything. I mean, you have to report everything you ever spent money on. And, you know, it's just, it's just an icky, arduous experience.

Here you are with this financial journey, declaring bankruptcy. You could have chose to sort of not say anything about it because you said that it was humiliating. I want to say, first of all, thank you for doing that, because I think when just by sharing your story, you realize how much of a service that can be, especially in this field.

This past year, I was giving a speech and I was talking about this, and afterwards a caregiver came up to me and she, her husband had been in the military and been injured in his service. And she said, you know, thank you for telling that story because we went through bankruptcy. And I have never told anyone, not even her family, no one.

Wow.

Because she was so embarrassed and ashamed, you know, so that's why I tell the story.

I think so many Americans really are, in this situation, live in fear and shame and guilt around it because. Because of what you just said. So I think it's so important that we talk about this because this isn't just a small percentage. This is an epidemic in a lot of ways.

The thing, too, is that it's all relative. Like, caregivers spend an average, about 26% of their income on out of pocket expenses for their loved ones. And so 26% of your income is a huge chunk. That's an average no matter whether you're making $20,000 a year or $200,000 a year, your life is built around a budget, and. And that's just what it takes.

Yeah. And by the way, it doesn't come in just neat monthly installments.

No, exactly.

Yeah. You can have no expenses for years and then suddenly drown from these kinds of things happening. So the unpredictability of it, to me, is what freaks me out. When we come back, we'll hear how, even through all the financial struggles, Amy focused on the joy of caregiving and celebrating the wins, no matter how small they may be.

Hello, I'm Joelle Brevel, medical Mythbuster and host of the Dose, a health policy podcast from the Commonwealth Fund. Each season, I sit down with a leading health policy expert and medical professionals to have real conversations about the issues that keep them up at night. We talk about breakthroughs in their research and their new ideas to make our healthcare system work better for all Americans. This idea of equity needs to be taken up by everyone. And wherever you are in your work, whatever sector that you're in, we need to have conversations about what tomorrow looks like. I hope you'll check out the dose and enjoy listening to our interviews. You can find us at thedose show or by searching your podcast app for the dose from the Commonwealth fund.

People love to pretend that there are simple formulas for living your best life. Now eat this and you won't get sick. Manifest it and everything will work out. But there are some things you can choose and some things you can't. And it's okay that life isn't always getting better. I'm Kate Bowler, and on everything happens, I speak with kind, smart, funny people about life as it really is. Beautiful, terrible, and everything in between. Let's be human together. Everything happens is available wherever you get your podcasts.

So you moderate a community of over 17,000 caregivers. It's probably that and counting at this point. On Facebook, I recently just joined. I saw that, yeah. And because I'm sort of starting on this caregiving journey for me, while I've been a caregiver pretty much my whole life, in some capacity, the amount of information out there as your parents get older is just. It's so vast. And being a part of this Facebook group, it's like real people, real stories, real examples. It's so different than going to a website or calling an 800 number.

Yes. I've always said that we learn the most from each other as caregivers because everybody's situation is so unique. It's hard to write a book or have a website that covers everything. I really feel like the Facebook group, which is called ARP's Family Caregivers discussion group, is the most important thing I've done in my entire career because we're helping people in the moment when they need it. In that moment when they are posting on that group, there's almost always 24/7 somebody can answer. We have people posting from the emergency room at 03:00 in the morning, and there's just almost always somebody who's going to give you a little bit of support or advice because, like you say, there's so much out there, which is great, but it's overwhelming and it's not always exactly what you need. And when you're a caregiver, you don't have time to. To try to navigate through all that. You just need help getting to the thing you need at the moment when you need it. So when you feel untethered, connect with another caregiver. Go to our Facebook group, talk to somebody, go to an in person support group. Know that there are other people who get it and talk about it, because it does help.

It does help, and people can help you figure it out.

Going through what you went through and having shared your story, having heard from people that have been so positively impacted from your story, what advice do you think you would give to someone who right now is in that situation of feeling? I am untethered.

If you're referring to the financial aspects of it, get some help. There are consumer credit counseling programs that are helpful. And also a financial planner, a financial advisor, or a financial counselor can be helpful. So make yourself vulnerable enough to talk to an expert about this. I think that's one of the key things to do. But also, you know, the thing is, you start to feel so unempowered. You know, we need to speak up for ourselves, and we need to speak to our legislators and our hospital administrators and everyone else and say, listen, I'm doing the best I can here, but I need some help. You know, the value of family caregivers in this country is $600 billion if we were being paid. Okay, so we're saving taxpayers, this country, a lot of money, but we need a little support.

Every time I hear that number, I feel like I've been punched in the gut. $600 billion. If you're wondering where that figure comes from, it's from a recent report that found that the average family caregiver is providing about 18 hours of unpaid labor each week. If you were to actually pay those folks $16.50 an hour, which, by the way, is a steal for in home care, you get that grand total of $600 billion. And the problem is we as a nation don't have a consistent system to value this work. A national policy on paid family and medical leave would make a huge difference here. And no matter what, just figuring out the system takes time and energy. Caregivers need more clarity and less complications. Let me just ask this question, because it's something that now, as I'm really getting into caregiving for my parents, I'm starting to think about, okay, I know what I want when I get to this age. I'm wondering if you've thought about that, like, how do you want it? Age. And.

Absolutely.

Yeah, right. It's crazy because, you know, I mean, I would have never thought about this until I started to take on this role. But I'm just curious if you, you've had thoughts about that.

Well, you know, working in this field, first of all, and I've seen it all, and so I have definite thoughts about that. But also, you know, it started even with my grandparents, you know, going back so far and what I've gone through with my parents, I very much do. And that's what's so scary about the bankruptcy and going through all my savings and everything is now I'm at an age where, you know, who knows how far off that is for me? And I don't have what I should have had and would have had if I hadn't done all those years of caregiving. So I am trying to catch up, and I'm working with a financial advisor, and I'm trying to figure those things out, but I'm looking at aging in place. The fun thing is that my boyfriend and I finally have moved in together after 17 years. And, you know, that's been a whole new thing. I mean, we buried the headline, you.

Know, I didn't know.

I thought we left him behind. I'm so glad he's here. Oh, he stuck with me, and I stuck with him, and we've, and we have just finished renovating a house, and clearly he's paid for most of it because I haven't had the money, but we designed it so there's a place where we can actually put in an elevator lift to get up because the house sits way up off the ground. We designed it so that we could easily live on the main floor alone. There is an accessible bathroom with a curbless shower and even a sink that you can get a wheelchair up to a room that can be used as a bedroom. So this is a home that people can stay in. And so I have thought about those things very much, and that's exciting to me. That's the fun thing to throw yourself into after the grief and through the grief is thinking, okay, what do I want now? And yes, it's hard when the finances have been drained by caregiving. And that's one of the reasons we need to support caregivers, because we're not doing anybody any favors by draining the caregiver's finances.

And then later, who's going to take care of us?

I want to end on this note, because you talk about this a lot, and certainly within the Facebook group as well, about celebrating the wins, big and small, talk about that, because I think that we, number one, I think that it's hard to stop and celebrate a win when you're just in the grind. And number two, it's even hard to figure out what's a win. Sometimes that's so small. Is it a win? Yeah.

I discovered that joy was my greatest survival skill. You know, there were times when I felt like I was such a failure because mom would fall again or something would happen, or this debt is rising and all of this. And I was very conscious of the fact that when I felt like a failure, I was not a good caregiver. I was not good at anything. And that's where I was like, okay, so I don't want to be a victim. What's the opposite of failure is success. So what can success look like for me that I know I can deliver? And that was just being there, just sticking with it, bringing joy to their lives. So if you look at it that way and experiencing joy and having joyful moments with your loved ones, then you actually notice the joys. You don't ignore them. Like when I tuck my mom into bed and she has this wonderful smile on her face, and she just. I knew she felt safe and loved and comfortable. And that meant everything to me. Now I could miss that moment because I've still got to get daddy ready for bed, and I've got to clean up the kitchen.

I've got to pause and notice that and fully feel it. That keeps us going. I developed a system of filling my tank, my internal tank, because I can't run on empty. So my internal tank is taking care of myself and getting sleep and doing all those things. But it's also joy. It's what makes that fuel gage go up inside me. It's that and it's, you know, we actually got to a doctor appointment on time today.

Yay.

You know, we went through Starbucks on the way home and got some lemonade. You know, dad actually ate his meal today. I mean, there are times when that is truly the thing that makes you so happy that he ate something.

I love what Amy says about holding on to those small moments. Your dad finishing a meal or your mom smiling after a long day. It makes me think about a video Amy posted on Facebook, a time when, after much prodding, her dad took a sip of his drink.

Thank you. It makes me very happy. Daddy, can you take another? Very good. Can you take another drink, please? Just a little bit less. Make a big gulp. Big sip of it.

And it's these moments, these little ones that I think keep us caregivers going. For me, it's anytime I'm in the kitchen with my mom or cooking with her, you know, just being with her. But we shouldn't have to go bankrupt trying to create these small moments of peace or keeping our loved ones safe and healthy. Imagine if caregivers didn't have to choose between going into debt and the well being of a loved one. On this season of uncared for, we'll have more guests and stories that will make you laugh, make you cry, and most importantly, make you nod your head in understanding.

It is a humongous sacrifice to say yes to caring for a parent. And I'm so grateful that I took.

The leap because I've got all these.

Memories ingrained as I can no longer make those with her anymore.

My wife and I would say these potty seats and commode manufacturers need to get together and like build a device that can accommodate sandwich generation households. More than anything, I remind people that caregiving is not her medications. Yeah, so I can put the alarm and give it to her. It's emotional.

I thought, I am never going to get anybody to date me while I'm taking care of my parents because this is a lot.

We'll also explore resources and solutions, things that help relieve the stress and policies that could make things better for everyone. Things like expanded Medicare benefits, reimbursements for family caregivers and state caregiver tax credits. And that's just a sliver of what could change. But in the meantime, there are resources you can look to, like credit counseling programs or health savings accounts. Check out the show notes for more ideas. How great would it be if we could stop dwelling on the question, who will pay for this? And instead focus that time and energy on the small wins and finding the joy. There's more uncared for with lemonade Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like unaired interview clips from caregivers across the country. Subscribe now. In Apple Podcasts uncared for is a production of Lemonade Media. I'm your host, Sujin Park. Muna Danish is our supervising producer. Lisa Fu and Hannah Boomershein are our producers. Our mix is by Ivan Kurayev. Music is by Andrea Christian's daughter. Our associate producer is Isaura Asimova. Jackie Danziger is our vp of narrative content. Executive producers are Jessica Cordova Kramer and Stephanie Whittleswacks. This season of Uncared for is presented by the Commonwealth Fund, a nonprofit foundation making grants to promote an equitable, high performing healthcare system.

Help others find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review. You can follow me on Instagram, ujimpak and Lemonade at Lemonade Media across all social platforms. Follow uncared for wherever you get your podcasts and listen ad free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Thanks so much for listening. See you next week. This show is presented by the Commonwealth Fund, a nonprofit foundation whose mission is to promote a high performing, equitable healthcare system. The Commonwealth Fund supports research to improve healthcare policy and practice and has a long history of exploring what the US can learn from the best health care around the world to do better here at home, especially for people of color, people with low income, and those who are uninsured. To learn more, visit commonwealthfund.org dot.

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